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Thread: Wtf

  1. #10

    Default Re: Wtf

    We have to: Have better shot selection, meaning only taking it if you arent going to be stuffed underneath. We also have to have better shot defense. I was surprised how guys got to our legs.

    Long list but this stands out.

    I hear the Brands brothers always say when someone asks about the differences between folk and free they always say "wrestling is wrestling." Well...this wrestling is different from that wrestling, and if we don't realize that I dont see us doing well for a long while.
    To avoid criticism say nothing, do nothing, be nothing.

  2. #11
    World Champ ODH's Avatar
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    Default Re: Wtf

    Quote Originally Posted by arm-spin View Post
    RD, this has all been said before but there are 3 pretty obvious reasons while the United States is not doing as well at freestyle as they used to.

    1: Folkstyle and freestyle have become less similar since the rule changes and the evolution of "funk" defense. Two of the most popular defenses in folkstyle- going out of bounds and rolling around- are ways to actively give up points in freestyle. You can't possibly practice 'scoring on yourself' for most of your life and hope to be as a good as a lifelong freestyler/greco wrestler.

    2: The breakup of the Soviet Union allows more wrestlers from the really productive areas of Russia to compete. For example, the big 3 at 96- Gayzumov, Gatsalov and Gogchelidze who each have a pile of world medals all wrestled for Russia at one time. In other words, the talent pool is much deeper.

    3: A lot of America's most sucessful wrestlers only compete for a limited time in freestyle ie Cejudo, Slay, Sanderson. You can't be the best when your best keep quitting. Where is Greg Jones, Ben Askren, Johnny Hendricks, Cole Konrad, Jake Rosholt and other American superstars? Be it MMA or just a regular job, a lot of wrestlers chose to do other more lucrative things that weaken the American talent pool.

    Finally, at the risk of sounding like a big jerk, it seems to me that Canada outdid the US this year in both women's and freestyle wrestling, with 3 medals in women's and 2 top-ten finishes in freestyle. Don't know if this has ever happened in FS before.
    Spot on anlysis and good job by the Canadians.

  3. #12
    World Champ ODH's Avatar
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    Default Re: Wtf

    Quote Originally Posted by arm-spin View Post
    ... Where is Greg Jones, Ben Askren, Johnny Hendricks, Cole Konrad, Jake Rosholt and other American superstars? Be it MMA or just a regular job, a lot of wrestlers chose to do other more lucrative things that weaken the American talent pool.
    Cole Konrad at least tried to give International wrestling a shot. If I remember he was not not making it up the FS ladder and then gave Geco a try for a little bit and could not make the national team either. The 264 lb weight was so supposed to be another reason he stopped wrestling, but I am pretty sure he needs to make 265 for MMA. At least he gave it a real try and that is what I would rather see than people like Hendricks going straight to MMA or worse a wrestler who is showing good results and lots of improvement essentially abandonning the sport for MMA (Askren). I am not blaming these guys, it is just disappointing to me as a wrestling fan.

    Heavyweight seems to be the exception where our best guys stick around for years (Mocco, Rowlands, Tolly) with a great bunch a youngster continuing to improve (Dlagnev, Sigman) which is probably why Heavy is usually our best weight.

  4. #13
    World Champ ODH's Avatar
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    Default Re: Wtf

    Quote Originally Posted by arm-spin View Post
    ...

    1: Folkstyle and freestyle have become less similar since the rule changes and the evolution of "funk" defense. Two of the most popular defenses in folkstyle- going out of bounds and rolling around- are ways to actively give up points in freestyle. You can't possibly practice 'scoring on yourself' for most of your life and hope to be as a good as a lifelong freestyler/greco wrestler.

    ....
    Another recent change has been the rise of prestigous National Folkstyle tournaments. Before if you wanted to be a true Junior National champ you had to go to Fargo.

  5. #14
    Olympic Champ therick's Avatar
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    Default Re: Wtf

    Quote Originally Posted by dirtyholt View Post
    Can you give me some specific examples of guys who are conditioning too much and how you know what their specific training regimes are like?
    Holt - I know you train at the OTC, so I'm asking you this. How much time do our guys spend specifically on refining and learning technique versus time spent on strength and conditioning? I'm asking for more of a general ratio thing....

    The reason I ask this, is because I've read from those who've trained in Russia, that they spend almost all of their time drilling and wrestling and very little time (by comparison) running, biking, lifting, etc. Do you think that we might benefit from spending more time just wrestling and using that as our primary means of conditioning?

    I also can't remember the last time I saw a US freestyle wrestler throw anyone. Aside from some pathetic (often slipped) attempts at arm throws. It seems that all of our guys are very limited in their array of technique. Doesn't that make us easier to defend? I watch Russian nationals from the last few years and I see tons of throws from multiple guys, I also see an array of technique that makes us look almost remedial in comparison.

    Is there any promotion or instruction on throwing at the national level? Do the coaches encourage the guys to step outside of their comfort zone when training and master new and different techniques? Or are we just focused on mastering the technique we already know?

  6. #15

    Default Re: Wtf

    Darrion Caldwell is coming soon, thats when you will get your gold.

  7. #16
    Olympic Champ r.payton@att.net's Avatar
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    Default Re: Wtf

    Coach Blubaugh said a Russian wrestler might wrestle 30 seconds a period , if that-Andrew Howe just came back and said pretty much the same thing -they work on technique and making one to two scores and stall the rest of the match . And as long as the ref's refuse to even warn a guy for stalling then the USA will keep falling behind .

  8. #17
    World Champ ODH's Avatar
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    Default Re: Wtf

    My understanding is that under the new rules there are no provisions for stalling. so the refs don't even have the option to call it.

  9. #18

    Default Re: Wtf

    you pretty much have to turn and run to get called for stalling, but i have seen cautions given to those who just hold and or dont do any hand fighting at all, best example otar tushivili when he lost to bill zaddick

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