There was no mass murder
There were no rape rooms
There were no torture chambers
There were no gassings
There were no disappearances
There was no intimidation
There was no fear
It was all peace love and harmony right Big?
It's like I said. It depends on how you define "violence". The items above were probably "encouragement" for the people to get along with each other in an ordered society.
It's like I said. It depends on how you define "violence". The items above were probably "encouragement" for the people to get along with each other in an ordered society.
Anyway, I was at Freestyle practice sitting by Dave, the Iraqi vet, and realized that everything I had heard on the Iraq War has come through the media and Dave and I had never talked about it. We'd talked wrestling, family, where we're from, etc. but never his experience so I asked him what it was like. He began with "it's nothing like what you see in the news media". He reiterated that later in the conversation so he was making a point. He was stationed in Ramadi when it was the hottest place for violence in Iraq and was there through the changes under Petraeus. I asking him what the effect was. He said "it was pretty boring, I'm not saying there was no violence at all but it was so scarce there wasn't much for us to do. The people were quite friendly once we got the local leaders on board". I asked him what the morale was and he mentioned "reenlistments are WAY up there and that the soldiers he knew (out of Fort Carson) are overwhelmingly for the effort. They feel like they have a mission that is worthwhile and they want to be allowed to complete it". I also mentioned the group Iraq Veteran's Against the War. His comment was "You're always going to have a few people that have a bad experience" but indicated that he feels they represent a very small minority in the big picture. I also asked him if he felt there was any direct connection between our presence in Iraq and potential terrorism by Al Qaida here in the States. He expressed that he feels if we don't do battle there we will be doing it here.
I have only heard indirect comments from one other Iraq veteran and ironically his observations of the situation there were almost identical. He was not out of Carson and they did not serve at the same time or place.
I want to see our troops come home as much as the next person but it was refreshing to hear something straight from someone who has been there and seen it first hand.
It is nice to get the unadorned comments, isn't it? Contrast your account of what Dave told you (real) with the rhetorically-laden account (full of disputed premises and us v. themism) from Weekly Standard you posted at the top of this thread.
God, TW. I mean, there're dozens of countries around the world torturing and stamping on the human rights of their citizens. Take Myanmar, Sudan, North Korea as a short list of examples. Why don't we take over their countries unprovoked?
My point is, don't try to paint the quagmire in Iraq as some sort of "humanitarian" mission. Only the sheep are buying that crap.
God, TW. I mean, there're dozens of countries around the world torturing and stamping on the human rights of their citizens. Take Myanmar, Sudan, North Korea as a short list of examples. Why don't we take over their countries unprovoked?
My point is, don't try to paint the quagmire in Iraq as some sort of "humanitarian" mission. Only the sheep are buying that crap.
You're absolutely right, jpv. Those children in Iraq didn't need schools built for them. The women in Iraq didn't really need to vote anyway. The people if Iraq don't want to be free and they certainly don't want to live under a government that doesn't kill them at a moment's notice.
You're right -- no good has come out of this war. Everything should be back how it was before. Out of sight, out of mind.
It would be premature to say what the long term results of the Iraqi war will be but the fact is a thriving free society among the Islamic nations would be the greatest threat to Islamofascism. There's something about freedom and it's benefits that people kind of like... most people, that is.
You're absolutely right, jpv. Those children in Iraq didn't need schools built for them. The women in Iraq didn't really need to vote anyway. The people if Iraq don't want to be free and they certainly don't want to live under a government that doesn't kill them at a moment's notice.
You're right -- no good has come out of this war. Everything should be back how it was before. Out of sight, out of mind.
Great post!
You must be careful though when you point out that we might actually being doing some good. You have to remember that the US under Bush is a terrible country.
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