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Obama ignoring Kentucky

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Old 05-19-2008, 09:36 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Obama ignoring Kentucky

Am I the only one who is worried about Obama's campaign strategy of ignoring Kentucky and previously West Virginia?

It seems clear that his strategy is to give up the states that he is not favored in and to win the states that he is favored in, which should allow him to win the delegate race as time runs out. Indeed, this will most likely allow him to win the delegate race and finish off his campaign to be the Democratic nominee. However, my concern is that this strategy is actually decreasing his popular vote lead, which is just going to give Hillary more justification to fight until the last minute, which will ultimately hurt Obama in the long run. The point is that there are Hillary supporters who think she deserves the nomination and will refuse to support Obama if he gets it. Several Hillary supporters have voiced voting for McCain or else writing in Hillary if Obama gets the nomination. The best chance Obama has to getting those votes is by taking Hillary as his V.P., and that still may not get all of them.

Right now Hillary is claiming that she is winning the popular vote, which nobody is listening to except her most naive supporters (Hillary's math just does not add up). The polls all have Obama winning Oregon and Hillary winning Kentucky, but Hillary's margin of victory is expected to be much larger than Obama's. There is a possible chance that Hillary may overtake Obama in the popular vote count even if the count ignores Michigan. Although that count is still disputable, it gives Hillary a much stronger argument and it gives her supporters much more reason to hang on and protest Obama.

If Obama were to at least make one trip to Kentucky, he would probably gain a lot more votes than his current strategy of betting everything on Oregon. This would benefit him in the popular vote count. What do you think?
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Old 05-19-2008, 09:42 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Default Re: Obama ignoring Kentucky

West Virginia I could understand - crap, a lot of those people think he is a Muslim for crying out loud. Anybody who has had any debates with creationalists can tell you that educating the willingly ignorant is next to impossible. I do think however he could have layed some groundwork for November in Kentucky.
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Old 05-19-2008, 10:04 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Default Re: Obama ignoring Kentucky

For the record, here are the popular vote counts before Tuesday according to various metrics from RealClearPolitics.com:


Popular Vote Total Obama +596,114 +1.8%

Estimate w/IA, NV, ME, WA* Obama +706,336 +2.1%

Popular Vote (w/FL) Obama +301,342 +0.9%

Estimate w/IA, NV, ME, WA* Obama +411,564 +1.2%

Popular Vote (w/FL & MI)** Clinton +26,967 +0.08%

Estimate w/IA, NV, ME, WA* Obama +83,255 +0.24%

The only way Clinton leads is if Michigan and Florida are counted, where Obama was not on the ballot, and if one ignores IA, NV, ME, and WA (where they only have estimates of popular vote count). Clinton will close the popular vote gap tomorrow because Obama is ignoring Kentucky.

The caveats:

*(Iowa, Nevada, Washington & Maine Have Not Released Popular Vote Totals. RealClearPolitics has estimated the popular vote totals for Senator Obama and Clinton in these four states. RCP uses the WA Caucus results from February 9 in this estimate because the Caucuses on February 9 were the “official” contest recognized by the DNC to determine delegates to the Democratic convention. The estimate from these four Caucus states where there are not official popular vote numbers increases Senator Obama’s popular vote margin by 110,224. This number would be about 50,000 less if the Washington primary results from February 19th were used instead of the Washington Caucus results.)

**(Senator Obama was not on the Michigan Ballot and thus received zero votes. Uncommitted was on the ballot and received 238,168 votes as compared to 328,309 for Senator Clinton.)
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Old 05-19-2008, 10:34 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Default Re: Obama ignoring Kentucky

It doesn't matter, unless Obama implodes by... losing Oregon (or North Carolina before that), this race is over. He is picking up the superdelegates and leads there. Will clinch the majority of delegates. And has already moved on to the general election debate where he hasn't been shy in making his case as to how he and McCain differ in foreign policy.

FWIW, my interest has moved on to the general election as well. McCain is my guy but in the real world of politics his party has been getting hammered of late, the economy is a huge issue and he has admitted he is weak there, and tying him to Bush - since he is supporting a lot of Bush's policies both foreign and economic - isn't that hard. On the otherhand, Obama hasn't been afraid to stake positions either (the whole gas tax issue - he stood by his guns despite the political risk).

Bottom line is both of these guys have the courage to stake out positions, but also realize they have to 'spin it' to the middle, and the base, at the same time. They both have sysdtemic weaknesses as well. McCain is trying to win in a year the Republican brand is going to get slaughtered. Obama has the racism thing, as well as the toothless redneck thing, against him.
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Old 05-19-2008, 10:45 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Default Re: Obama ignoring Kentucky

The toothless rednecks bark is worse then its bite.
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Old 05-19-2008, 10:49 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Default Re: Obama ignoring Kentucky

I agree that Obama has the Democratic nomination wrapped up.... My point is that the closer Hillary ends up at the end of the race, the worse it will be for Obama in September. Many angry Hillary supporters will not support Obama if they believe that Hillary should have been the true nominee. Obama should not let Hillary have any type of argument that her most sincere supporters can hang on to. In particular, don't let her close the popular vote gap!
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Old 05-20-2008, 12:31 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Default Re: Obama ignoring Kentucky

Here we are, this story puts it in perspective, and Clinton's argument will become less intellectually dishonest after Tuesday, thanks to Obama ignoring Kentucky.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/05/20/us...49b&ei=5087%0A

As Time Runs Short, Clinton Claims Lead in Popular Vote

Senator Hillary Rodham Clinton is entering the Kentucky and Oregon primaries on Tuesday with one of the most pugnacious political messages of her campaign: That she is ahead in the national popular vote when all votes are counted, including from the unsanctioned primaries in Michigan and Florida, and that party leaders who have a vote as super-delegates should reflect this level of appeal.

This argument is of a piece with Mrs. Clinton’s increasingly populist image, as a fighter on behalf of average people, but it is also a debatable claim: Most tallies of the national popular vote put Mr. Obama in the lead, especially when Michigan and Florida are not counted.

Mr. Obama has declared his own lead in the national vote and is solidly ahead in the overall delegate count, and he intends to use the results of the Kentucky and Oregon primaries to declare on Tuesday night that he has secured a majority of the pledged delegates from primaries and caucuses.

While that does not guarantee the nomination, his campaign argues that it is an important moment and crucial for superdelegates to consider as well.

Yet Mr. Obama does not plan to declare outright victory, his advisers say, because he does not want to appear to be pushing Mrs. Clinton out of the race. At this stage, his advisers say, he wants to treat her gracefully as a worthy Democratic fighter, not as a stubborn nemesis.

The arguments over the cold math of the nomination contest will play out against a backdrop of two states that are likely to show once more the divisions in the Democratic electorate that have been exposed in this two-candidate contest: Mr. Obama is expected to win the primary in Oregon, a largely white state with a fairly liberal Democratic base, while Mrs. Clinton is expected to win in Kentucky, which has a strong working-class vote.

Mrs. Clinton won a commanding victory last Tuesday in neighboring West Virginia, where racial considerations emerged as an unusually evident factor for some Democratic voters, according to exit polls. Both Clinton and Obama advisers say they are unsure if this will happen again in Kentucky, but they do not rule it out; Clinton advisers add that they believe race was a relatively small factor in the West Virginia vote.

While the Clinton campaign has aggressively pressed its popular-vote argument in Kentucky, Mrs. Clinton has also been decrying the media in Washington for all but crowning Mr. Obama as the Democratic nominee, as Tim Russert of NBC News did two weeks ago on the night of the Indiana and North Carolina primaries. Clinton advisers say that pitting Mrs. Clinton and the voters, on one side, against Mr. Obama and Washington pundits will be a main theme of hers in the final primary contests.

Mrs. Clinton has sounded almost like a professor of political science on the trail, explaining how the popular vote should be calculated by her lights, as she did before an audience in Kentucky on Monday.

“I believe that with your help we will send a message to this country because right now more people have voted for me than have voted for my opponent,” she said. “More people have voted for me than for anybody ever running for president before. So we have a very close contest for votes, for delegates, and this is nowhere near over. None of us is going to have the number of delegates we’re going to need to get to the nomination, although I understand my opponent and his supporters are going to claim that.

“The fact is we have to include Michigan and Florida — we cannot claim that we have a nominee based on 48 states, particularly two states that are so important for us to win in the fall,” Mrs. Clinton said.

If all states with popular vote totals are counted — which would exclude four caucus states that have not released numbers — Mrs. Clinton would lead Mr. Obama by more than 26,000 votes out of more than 33 million cast. By other calculations, Mr. Obama is ahead in the popular vote.

The Democratic National Committee will meet later this month to consider how to count Michigan and Florida in the nomination fight, if at all. Mr. Obama is right now aiming at accumulating 2,025 delegates, the number needed for the nomination if Michigan and Florida are left out. The Clinton campaign is arguing that the delegate goal will be higher because the two states should be counted.

Robert Zimmerman, a New York media consultant who is a major fund-raiser for Mrs. Clinton, said the popular-vote argument was a good political framework for her candidacy because it emphasizes her electability in the fall. He also said it would be fair to count Michigan and Florida when Democrats are also counting the votes from state caucuses, which require people to participate at a certain time of the day, and therefore tend to leave shift workers and laborers at a disadvantage.

“The controversies concerning the inequities of the caucus system, the Michigan and Florida primaries and the focus on electability by both campaigns makes the issue of the popular vote critically important to superdelegates,” Mr. Zimmerman said. “It should be expected that any potential nominee wins the popular vote on the way to the nomination”

Mr. Obama, meanwhile, has declared his own lead in the national vote by factoring out the Michigan and Florida contests, since the Democratic Party did not approve them, none of the candidates campaigned there, and Mr. Obama took himself off the ballot in Michigan.

His advisers argue that Mrs. Clinton’s claim of a popular vote lead is intellectually dishonest — and note that it echoes recent statements by none other than Karl Rove, President Bush’s former political adviser, who has argued that Mrs. Clinton would be a stronger opponent this fall against Senator John McCain in the electoral college contest.
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Old 05-20-2008, 12:34 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Default Re: Obama ignoring Kentucky

Note: even if you keep the Florida count and drop the Michigan count, then Obama is still in the lead (the New York Times article does not mention this). After Tuesday, I predict that Hillary may surpass Obama by this count, or if not, it will at least be much much closer. That is not good for Obama, regardless of whether he wins the delegate count or not. Those angry Hillary supporters will be vicious to Obama. Remeber folks, you heard it here first. From your neighbourly political analyst, Mr Contini.
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Old 05-20-2008, 01:59 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Default Re: Obama ignoring Kentucky

Originally Posted by contini View Post
Note: even if you keep the Florida count and drop the Michigan count, then Obama is still in the lead (the New York Times article does not mention this). After Tuesday, I predict that Hillary may surpass Obama by this count, or if not, it will at least be much much closer. That is not good for Obama, regardless of whether he wins the delegate count or not. Those angry Hillary supporters will be vicious to Obama. Remeber folks, you heard it here first. From your neighbourly political analyst, Mr Contini.
Why would you include one but not the other? I'm not rooting for Ms. Clinton here, but if she is leading in the popular vote (without any estimated figures included), then she has an argument. Just have the caucus states release their totals, and it should put it to rest, right?
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Old 05-20-2008, 04:47 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Default Re: Obama ignoring Kentucky

She is certainly trying to make it look like she is leading the popular vote, and she will have a much less fictional argument after tomorrow!
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