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Thread: Nazi Germany-American connection

  1. #37

    Default Re: Nazi Germany-American connection

    It's about 30- 45 million people that died during the purges, and that figure is widely accepted by most historians. Those demographics don't prove anything. Stalin could have had his statisticians make up those numbers. Even still, look at how slowly the population increased. 45 million from the day Stalin stepped into office and left. Out of those numbers, 30 million would be Russians. Big, Russians were not even half of the population of USSR. 45 million people died during Stalin's reign which is about 20 years. During those years, look how little the populaiton doubled. The populaiton can still be going up slowly with people dying, because other ethnic groups like non russians are outpacing the russians.

  2. #38

    Default Re: Nazi Germany-American connection

    Quote Originally Posted by Big View Post
    A lower than 30 million number is also supported by looking at demographics:

    January 1897 (Russia): 125,640,000***
    1911(Russia): 167,003,000**
    January 1920 : 137,727,000*
    January 1926 : 148,656,000*
    January 1937: 162,500,000*
    January 1939: 168,524,000*
    June 1941: 196,716,000*
    January 1946: 170,548,000*
    January 1951: 182,321,000*
    January 1959: 209,035,000*
    January 1970: 241,720,000
    1985: 272,000,000
    July 1991: 293,047,571

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demogra...e_Soviet_Union

    Note that Russian population decreased by 30 million between 1911 and 1920This includes the time during Russian Revolution and Civil war. This was way before Stalin took over power. This number could easily be blamed on Stalin.

    Note that during Stalin's rule, except for WWII, Soviet population increased. How could 30 million die under Stalin, yet the population increased? Impossible!

    From 1926 to 1946 which was stalin's reign and 1946 which was the end of the purges, the population only increased by about 22 million. Now let's see what happened after Stalin's death. From 1946 to 1970 the populaiton increased from 170,548,000* to 241,720,000 which is about 70 million. So, from 1946 to 1970 if 30 million people had died, the population still would have gone up by 40 million. This proves my point that massive purges can still be done and the total population can still increase which happened during Stalin's reign.

  3. #39
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    Default Re: Nazi Germany-American connection

    Quote Originally Posted by satiev1 View Post
    From 1926 to 1946 which was stalin's reign and 1946 which was the end of the purges, the population only increased by about 22 million. Now let's see what happened after Stalin's death. From 1946 to 1970 the populaiton increased from 170,548,000* to 241,720,000 which is about 70 million. So, from 1946 to 1970 if 30 million people had died, the population still would have gone up by 40 million. This proves my point that massive purges can still be done and the total population can still increase which happened during Stalin's reign.

    Of course saitiev, completely leave out the fact that Hitler killed 26 million Soviets between 1941 and 1946. Fom 1926 till 1941 the population increased by almost 50 million.

  4. #40

    Default Re: Nazi Germany-American connection

    Big, the Russian population stood at around 50 percent. Purges don't happen in one year. They happen over the course of many years. During Stalin's reign around 30 million Soviets died with the majority of those being Russian. Demographics don't tell us how many people died, they just count the populaiton. If Stalin kills 10 million people, but 15 million more are born then the population increased by 5 million and so forth. One of the main reasons for the populaiton going up was the populaiton increase in all other republics. If Stalin had killed as many other ethnic groups in proportion to their populaiton, then they would all be extinct today.
    Last edited by satiev1; 05-17-2007 at 01:33 PM.

  5. #41
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    Default Re: Nazi Germany-American connection

    satiev,

    Mostly Ukrainians died during 1930s famine, not Russians. Stop being so narrow-minded on this.

  6. #42

    Default Re: Nazi Germany-American connection

    According to that link you posted.

    While death rates did not differ greatly across regions of the USSR through much of Soviet history, birth rates in southern republics of Transcaucasia and Central Asia were much higher than those in the northern parts of the Soviet Union, and in some cases even increased in the post-World War II period.

    As a result mainly of differential birthrates, with most of the "European" nationalities moving toward sub-replacement fertility and the Central Asian and other nationalities of southern republics having well-above replacement-level fertility, the percentage who were Russians was gradually being reduced. According to some Western scenarios of the 1990s, if the Soviet Union had stayed together it is likely that Russians would have lost their majority status in the first decade of the 21st century

  7. #43

    Default Re: Nazi Germany-American connection

    Ukranians did die, but they weren't the majority. You can't take one major event and say it was all ukranians. The gulags and peasant killings were all in Russia.

  8. #44
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    Default Re: Nazi Germany-American connection

    saitiev,

    Most ethnic Russians died during Russian Revolution, Civil War and World War II, not during Stalin's purges. I agree that ethnic Russians like no other group paid the most fighting Nazi Germany. To say Stalin targeted Russians specifically in his purges is absurd.

  9. #45

    Default Re: Nazi Germany-American connection

    I don't know if he targeted them specifically, but they were the majority of who he killed. So the other reason is that they were the biggest threat to him since the kremlin was in Russia and all the top guys around him were Russian.

    By the way Big, here's an article about the demographics.
    http://www.newsweekly.com.au/article...n28_cover.html

    The Kremlin went to great lengths to cover up the magnitude of Soviet population losses resulting from Stalin's reign of terror in the 1930s. It suppressed the results of the 1937 census because, according to an official statement, it contained "grave mistakes owing to the activities of enemies of the people". The real reason, of course, was that the census would have revealed a massive population deficit. So rather than disclose the truth, the Soviet government had the entire census board staff shot as spies.

    A "revised" census was published in 1939 - this time, with grossly inflated population figures. But even this revealed that roughly 10 per cent of the Soviet population was statistically missing, i.e., some 15 million victims of Stalin's reign of terror.

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