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Thread: Record number of people in U.S. prisons

  1. #28

    Default Re: Record number of people in U.S. prisons

    Quote Originally Posted by sgallan View Post
    It's a blood lust dude...... and I would even go so far to take matters into my own hands.

    I am thinking this sort of societal attitude is why we are in the boat we are in. We are the same..... I just don't think it is good we are the same. You do. You like the punishment..... me, I am just a product of the environment..... which is in a weird way the samething.
    No, I don't like punishment. But, I do think that it is better than the alternative. ANY sort of deterrent is better than no deterrent. Plus, prison removes offenders from society so that they can not infringe on the rights of the innocent for the period of their incarceration. If we immediately let them go, they may re-offend, which takes us from a free society to one run by lawlessness -- bad news.

    But, please explain to me what a product of environment is. How can you believe that people can be rehabilitated (which would require them to personally shun temptation) if you don't think that people have the ability to shun temptation in the first place? Your arguments contradict each other.

  2. #29

    Default Re: Record number of people in U.S. prisons

    Quote Originally Posted by sgallan View Post
    This post has shown that you are a hypocrite. You have not grounds to call others callous and heartless when you advocate doing those things yourself.

    As do you..... but just cloak your vengence under the "rule of Law" (which all the vicious societies in history have done). We are the same. Both of us monsters. But who is the hypocrite? I at least admit being a product of a society. You are a monster with "legal grounds".
    You sitll haven't shown me how I am a hypocrite. I have advocated freedom for those who do not infringe on the freedoms of others. Those who do infringe on the freedoms of others should lose their freedom for a period of time as a deterrent.

    Where is the hypocrisy?

    Beside, I have no lust for vengence, unlike you. I don't want to get anybody back for anything. I only want to install deterrents and to keep offenders from hurting others. You, though, have shown that you do want vengence. You just want to hurt people who hurt you, instead of thinking of others.

  3. #30

    Default Re: Record number of people in U.S. prisons

    [QUOTE=sgallan;43292]This post has shown that you are a hypocrite. You have not grounds to call others callous and heartless when you advocate doing those things yourself.

    As do you..... but just cloak your vengence under the "rule of Law" (which all the vicious societies in history have done). We are the same. Both of us monsters. But who is the hypocrite? I at least admit being a product of a society. You are a monster with "legal grounds".[QUOTE]

    We are a nation of laws -- which protect freedom. If I have "legal grounds," by definition, I am on the side of protecting freedom.

    I'll take that any day over stealing freedom and killing people.

  4. #31

    Default Re: Record number of people in U.S. prisons

    Quote Originally Posted by sgallan View Post
    But, please explain to me what a product of environment is.

    Baby born to a crack mom. Raised in a house where mom is a prostitute and the child has some brain damage due to pre-natal drug addiction. Raised in an environment where what most people consider good is bad, and vice-versa, where older siblings burn them "just to see what it looks like".

    You want more (I have lots), or are you one of those middle class white dudes who grew up in a perfect little world where everybody should be just like you?

    Say..... I have an idea.... since you seem to think parents and environments don't count.... maybe from this point forward I should start abusing my child... quit making her do her school work.... teach her that stealing is a good thing..... maybe prostitute her out (tons of money with this kid).... and expect her to turn out just perfect.

    Are you really this dumb.

    Now I remember why I don't post on this board much. The other board has their idiots, but mostly they have a heart. This board has smart people that are heartless. That bothers me more than anything else. I think I'll bail. You and Big can play your game, I am outta here.
    You have brought your kid into threads before as a human shield -- you don't need to do it again.

    I am VERY familiar with some of the situations you mentioned.

    Raised in an environment where what most people consider good is bad, and vice-versa, where older siblings burn them "just to see what it looks like".

    My wife grew up in this EXACT situation. She is now a VERY loving person with a masters degree and teaches 3rd grade in public school.

    Baby born to a crack mom. Raised in a house where mom is a prostitute and the child has some brain damage due to pre-natal drug addiction.

    My wife's best friend in elementary school was born into almost this very situation. She is now a research scientist at Michigan State University in their physics program.

    According to your definition, they should have just counted on the world not liking them and they should have resorted to lawlessness. But, they saw differently. They saw that they could get away from that if they tried -- and they did get away from that world.

    As for myself, I don't usually like to give away too much info about myself, but I will give you a little taste.

    I was born into a family that VERY poor. We mined coal and sharecropped tobacco to get by, but had only enough money to put out the next years crop -- no shoes, clothes, or car for us.

    Now, I am 2 months away from my PhD and I am as law-abiding as they come.

    I know what it takes to stay out of the situations that you described earlier. I know first hand that there is no such thing as product of environment. Each person can make choices. Either you choose to live in that lawless manner or you choose not to.

  5. #32
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    Default Re: Record number of people in U.S. prisons

    Quote Originally Posted by sgallan View Post
    They have kids and family..... but you don't really care about them either.... you do. Mom does drugs and the baby dies... you are cool with that. You are a monster in my view.
    Who said they were cool with your scenario? No one that I've read on here yet.

    I agree that there are those that are born behind the 8ball in life. Some grow up to be sociopaths through no real fault of their own. Using your examples.

    However, what should we do with those people? Should we allow them to infringe on the rights of those who follow the law. Should we allow them to kill, steal, rape, assault, etc.?

    I really don't have any really good ideas for how else to deal with this small sect of society, except to remove them from society so that they are no longer a danger to themselves or others. You seem to have all of the answers from your years in the prison system, what's the alternative?

  6. #33
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    Default Re: Record number of people in U.S. prisons

    Sorry for the deletions.... I spend so much time trying to help and people like Skipster often have me question why I should bother even trying.

    Now I remember why I don't do this board..... it just seems so cold and harsh.
    I am 49, bald, ugly, and don't own a single cool thing. Kids like me though.

  7. #34
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    Default Re: Record number of people in U.S. prisons

    I'm not sure why some on this board dislike you so much skipster. I think you make perfect sense.

  8. #35

    Default Re: Record number of people in U.S. prisons

    Quote Originally Posted by sgallan View Post
    Sorry for the deletions.... I spend so much time trying to help and people like Skipster often have me question why I should bother even trying.

    Now I remember why I don't do this board..... it just seems so cold and harsh.
    [I]Cold and harsh[I]...

    Just like telling us all about how you'll kill, maim, and torture anyone who harms one of your family members instead of letting the civilized justice system handle the matter?

    Just as cold and harsh as holding your kid up as a human shield in an internet message board thread?

    Come on, gallan!! Use your head!! You have said things more cold and heartless than anyone else on this board, then you expect us to believe that it is too cold and harsh for you?!

    You'll have to look for sympathy somewhere else. You can't pull wool over the eyes of the posters on this board.

  9. #36
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    Default Re: Record number of people in U.S. prisons

    Quote Originally Posted by sgallan View Post
    Now I remember why I don't do this board..... it just seems so cold and harsh.
    Is the other one better? I haven't been over there in quite some time - except for an occasional glance when I'm very, very bored.
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