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Thread: Religion in public schools

  1. #19
    Ancient Arachnid Spider's Avatar
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    Default Re: Religion in public schools

    Quote Originally Posted by Ground&Pound View Post
    This is from the FCA (Fellowship of Christian Athletes) website
    http://image.teamfca.net/siteuploadf...D1DBD4F824.pdf

    Q What recourse does FCA have if the school refuses to recognize FCA as a
    student club?

    A If your school denies an FCA club equal access to resources or facilities, or has
    established restrictions that infringe upon your freedoms of speech or religion, you should meet
    with your principal or dean to discuss the matter and request a resolution. The Alliance Defense
    Fund (?ADF?) can provide documentation to help you explain the law. Should school officials
    still refuse to adjust their policy or practice, ADF can write a letter on your behalf to ask that the
    school officials correct their actions, and then look into the possibility of litigation in court if the
    school persists in its unlawful conduct.
    I'm no lawyer, but I don't think that an organization with a religious agenda has an implicit right to use the school facilities. If they do, the law to which they refer needs to be looked at.
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  2. #20

    Default Re: Religion in public schools

    If you have a problem with this passage... wait until you get to the parts about bulletin board space and funding.

  3. #21
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    Default Re: Religion in public schools

    Quote Originally Posted by UGLY View Post
    You don't agree that religion exists? I was saying that just because the schools allow these groups doesn't mean that they are promoting one race over another, even though they will not allow a white male club on campus because of the racial perception of it.
    You can't equate how races are dealt with and how religions are dealt with. I didn't say that religions don't exist, but what they are based upon are issues of faith, not fact. Races are comprised of people who are what they are, with no faith involved. As far as whether allowing an organization access to school facilities promotes that organization over others, it does not - but it does imply that the school supports what the organization professes. It is not proper for a public institution to take any stance which implies that it supports the beliefs of any religion, since belief in one necessarily negates belief in all others - if you don't agree with this, just ask the Pope.

    Public institutions must remain religiously neutral. This doesn't mean accepting them all, it means "no comment."
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  4. #22
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    Default Re: Religion in public schools

    Quote Originally Posted by Ground&Pound View Post
    If you have a problem with this passage... wait until you get to the parts about bulletin board space and funding.
    Don't tell me - I'm an old man with high blood pressure.
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  5. #23
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    Default Re: Religion in public schools

    Okay, I'm going to watch Law and Order. I'll check back during commercials and then at 11:00.
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  6. #24

    Default Re: Religion in public schools

    Big, if the end is so near I'd think we could use all the prayer we could get. No?
    "All my life I have tried to pluck a thistle and plant a flower wherever the flower would grow in thought and mind." -- Abraham Lincoln

  7. #25

    Default Re: Religion in public schools

    Spider, Make sure you are sitting down before you read this. If you are on any type of prescription tranquilizers, now might be the time to go to your stash, and take one, before you read on.

    Teacher's are allowed to lead a group after or before school, but not during school. After, or before school, they are like any other citizen. They don't give up their off duty rights, because of their particuliar profession.

    However, they cannot use their position as a teacher to coherse students to attend Bible Studies, or whatever. If a student asks about their faith, they are allowed to tell the student what their personal opinion on the matter is, and they should make sure the student understands that this is not the position of the school they represent.

    As someone may say, there is no God, or I don't know that there is a God, a Christian can say I know there is a God, because I experience his presence. We are all entitled to express our religous beliefs.

    Students are allowed to talk to other students about their faith at appropiate times, when students are allowed to excercise their free speech rights, such at breaks, lunch hour, recess, etc......

    Students are also allowed to hand out religious tracts during their free time at school.
    Schools, or public libraries who allow the use of community rooms to secular clubs, must also allow religious clubs the same access as the other clubs. This is called equal access. You cannot discriminate against anybody, or any club, because of their religious beliefs.

    The Government cannot establish a Religion, but also it cannot stifle religious expression, at appropiate times, as some would wish.

    For more information you can read this guide. A Teacher's Guide to Religion in the Public Schools.
    http://www.freedomforum.org/publicat...chersguide.pdf

    Or you can go to lc.org. Liberty Counsel has had many high profile cases that have went all the way to the Supreme Court. They have stifled the ACLU's quest to stifle religious expression in the public square many times. They have also filed many Amicus Briefs in religious discrimination suits, all the way up to the Supreme Court level.

    Most all of what I have talked about has already been settled in the highest courts in the land. As I said, you can check out LC.ORG for more information. They will also represent you for free on cases of religious discrimination, no matter your faith. They not only represent Christians, but muslims budhists, or whatever.
    Last edited by JustFishing; 02-21-2008 at 12:50 AM.

  8. #26
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    Default Re: Religion in public schools

    Teacher's are allowed to lead a group after or before school, but not during school. After, or before school, they are like any other citizen. They don't give up their off duty rights, because of their particuliar profession.

    However, they cannot use their position as a teacher to coherse students to attend Bible Studies, or whatever.


    When teachers are interacting with students in a school setting, they do not have total freedom of speech. Again, I'll use the analogy - would the school allow a meeting of a racist hate group before or after school in a classroom? No, racism is not the same as religion, but the point is that you can't use the freedom of speech argument to justify access. If they want to meet at off campus, and it's clear that the teacher is acting as a private citizen and not a teacher, no problem.

    If a student asks about their faith, they are allowed to tell the student what their personal opinion on the matter is, and they should make sure the student understands that this is not the position of the school they represent.

    Absolutely, I have no problem with that, but a private conversation is very different from an organized meeting.

    As someone may say, there is no God, or I don't know that there is a God, a Christian can say I know there is a God, because I experience his presence. We are all entitled to express our religous beliefs.

    Students are allowed to talk to other students about their faith at appropiate times, when students are allowed to excercise their free speech rights, such at breaks, lunch hour, recess, etc......


    Of course we can express our beliefs as private citizens, but not as representatives of a government institution.

    Students are also allowed to hand out religious tracts during their free time at school.
    Schools, or public libraries who allow the use of community rooms to secular clubs, must also allow religious clubs the same access as the other clubs. This is called equal access. You cannot discriminate against anybody, or any club, because of their religious beliefs.

    The Government cannot establish a Religion, but also it cannot stifle religious expression, at appropiate times, as some would wish.


    This is not proper. The phrase "at appropriate times" should include "and appropriate places," namely, the school. This is not discrimination because of religious beliefs. Discrimination because of religious beliefs would be, "We don't want any Jews in the Chess Club."

    I don't doubt that this is an accurate description of the law as it stands, but there are many laws which need to be corrected.

    Now where's my defibrillator?
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  9. #27

    Default Re: Religion in public schools

    When i was a kid we had to do religious study and sing psalms, i don't know a single one of these children who is christian or religious.
    It shouldn;t have happened and was a joke.

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