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Thread: Ill. faces 66 percent tax boost amid budget crisis

  1. #10
    Olympic Champ r.payton@att.net's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ill. faces 66 percent tax boost amid budget crisis

    UGLY,
    As you know I live in Indiana . We have seen ALL industry jobs disappear-teaching jobs are being cut every day -Pensions of all sorts are being raided daily . Men in their prime (at least when you are as old as me ) are forced into early retirement and then having the benefits which allowed them to retire are being stripped away. Foreclosures are at an all time high. The graduation rate at my old high school-once tops in the nation -now stand at 47% . Uneducated , poor and angry people are the breeding grounds for criminals and other deviant behaviors. Apathy is at an all time high-although how that is measured is beyond my understanding . Is it based on lack of voter turn out ? If so-then they are wrong as I am far from apathetic I just refuse to vote for a lying POS wearing blue or one wearing red.
    I say our country is insolvent NOW. I see 3 ways to get us on the right track-
    1) Stop the idiotic WAR on DRUGS. Especially marijuana-legalize it and then tax it to death. I read a recent study where THAT measure alone would provide billions in revenue per state.
    2)-Stop the War on TERROR ..the sinking of the Luisitania gave Wilson the excuse he needed-Pearl Harbor gave FDR his long awaited reason to enter WWII,Hitler consolidated his power with the Reichstach fire, GW Bush had 911...
    3)-Completely restructure the tax system . I am one of the 50% who pay NO taxes . Here is what a disabled man of 54 gets to live on--$6,768.00 Annually.I am reading from my SSA-1099 form as I type. I also receive $48.00 per month in food stamps. I have NOT had a COLA in 3 years and out of the $800,000,000,000.00 stimulus package I received a one time check for $210.00 .Exactly HOW much in taxes would you have me pay ?
    I will NOT tolerate this much longer. I cannot. I am a broken down gimp in pain every day WITH zero hope in sight -I type this not looking for pity or a handout-simply explaining life from WELL below the poverty line. I want to live long enough to see what happens when the 1.2 million people get out of prison after doing 10 years for having a couple of joints - if nothing-I will walk out on the ice flow as I am of no use and a hindrance to the tribe.

  2. #11
    Super Moderator UGLY's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ill. faces 66 percent tax boost amid budget crisis

    Quote Originally Posted by r.payton@att.net View Post
    UGLY,
    As you know I live in Indiana . We have seen ALL industry jobs disappear-teaching jobs are being cut every day -Pensions of all sorts are being raided daily . Men in their prime (at least when you are as old as me ) are forced into early retirement and then having the benefits which allowed them to retire are being stripped away. Foreclosures are at an all time high. The graduation rate at my old high school-once tops in the nation -now stand at 47% . Uneducated , poor and angry people are the breeding grounds for criminals and other deviant behaviors. Apathy is at an all time high-although how that is measured is beyond my understanding . Is it based on lack of voter turn out ? If so-then they are wrong as I am far from apathetic I just refuse to vote for a lying POS wearing blue or one wearing red.
    I say our country is insolvent NOW. I see 3 ways to get us on the right track-
    1) Stop the idiotic WAR on DRUGS. Especially marijuana-legalize it and then tax it to death. I read a recent study where THAT measure alone would provide billions in revenue per state.
    2)-Stop the War on TERROR ..the sinking of the Luisitania gave Wilson the excuse he needed-Pearl Harbor gave FDR his long awaited reason to enter WWII,Hitler consolidated his power with the Reichstach fire, GW Bush had 911...
    3)-Completely restructure the tax system . I am one of the 50% who pay NO taxes . Here is what a disabled man of 54 gets to live on--$6,768.00 Annually.I am reading from my SSA-1099 form as I type. I also receive $48.00 per month in food stamps. I have NOT had a COLA in 3 years and out of the $800,000,000,000.00 stimulus package I received a one time check for $210.00 .Exactly HOW much in taxes would you have me pay ?
    I will NOT tolerate this much longer. I cannot. I am a broken down gimp in pain every day WITH zero hope in sight -I type this not looking for pity or a handout-simply explaining life from WELL below the poverty line. I want to live long enough to see what happens when the 1.2 million people get out of prison after doing 10 years for having a couple of joints - if nothing-I will walk out on the ice flow as I am of no use and a hindrance to the tribe.
    Payton I agree with all of your solutions. I would only legalize Marijuana, no other drugs and I would tax it to death. We should get out of Iraq and Afghanistan and we should restructure our tax code. The question is what to restructure it to. A flat progressive tax with no deductions would be fine with me. People in your position would be tax exempt. But there are people who make money that pay nothing. Nearly everyone could pay 500 or so dollars a year, and it would make a difference. I dont think it is right that the rich get to write off so much and I also dont like the idea of punishing them because they are wealthy. Everyone who can pay should, and I think we know who can and can not. Sacrifice will be needed on all sides.

    I also agree with Quinn when he wants to see responsible spending before we think about giving more money to the government. As most people are apt to do the government will just spend whatever extra it takes in, just because it is there.

  3. #12

    Default Re: Ill. faces 66 percent tax boost amid budget crisis

    Quote Originally Posted by M Richardson View Post
    Exactly who are you referring to when you say "non-government people"? I am a "government person" - that is, I am a state government employee. I am required to take 3 days a month off - at no pay. However, because we are understaffed, I can't actually take the days off, I have to "bank" them. The catch is, if I don't use them by a specific date, I lose them. So I am required to take them, but not allowed to, and will lose them eventually if I don't take them. So far I have about 95 days of furlough time banked. I'll take 15 days vacation this year - so I can use furlough for that - but I will accrue 36 days this year. How do I use the other 21 days? I will eventually lose them - a 14+% pay cut to help the state meet its financial obligations.
    Along with that, my supervisors can require me to work overtime - a sixteen hour day. They can hold me 2 days in a row (which gives me about 4 hours sleep between shifts), then a regular 8 hour shift, then - if necessary, another 2 in a row. I have had months when I have worked 8 to 10 overtime shifts in a month. Great overtime check, right? If I take a sick day, or a vacation day, or any other time off I get paid straight time for the overtime. So they can force me to work the overtime, then take it away if I take the time I am contractually deserving.
    I figure I have been "donating" around $1000 to $1500 per month to help the state of California balance its budget.
    That sounds like it sucks. Doesn't seem fair to me at all. What I meant was, the government and governmental jobs didn't lose anywhere close to the number of jobs as the private sector, yet that same government wants people to pay more taxes so they can spend more. Everyone, including you, have had to adjust their spending habits due to the economy. Why doesn't the government do that instead of just asking for more money?

  4. #13

    Default Re: Ill. faces 66 percent tax boost amid budget crisis

    Quote Originally Posted by UGLY View Post
    This is what I know to be a fact. In CA they have the highest state taxes of all the states and the 9th largest economy in the world and tehy are still going broke. Part of this issue might be because 80% of all tax revenue goes to pay for state employees. That is 80% of the budget that can not be touched by the state government to attempt to balance the budget. That is a serious issue that will not be resolved without concessions from a lot of people. NY is is the same type of scenario and they dont pay their public employees like police and fire a wage that they can live on in NY. We are entering a time when state and federal government needs to reign in spending and perhaps raise taxes a bit in order to keep our nation solvent.
    Of COURSE 80% goes to payroll. Government doesn't provide widgits - it provides services. The parks are already there. The state is paying for people to maintain them. The roads are there. The state is paying for people to stand next to them leaning on shovels (sorry, couldn't resist). The largest single portion of the state budget - something like 40%, is to K-12 education. Teachers, custodians, bus drivers, etc. providing services.
    That money can be touched - just as soon as the people of California are willing to do without the services provided. Shut down the parks, or only open them on weekends. Put 40 kids in a classroom - and buy new books every 15 years instead of 7. Prisons are easy - go back to warehousing prisoners. It is really pretty easy for 2 staff to watch a couple of hundred prisoners if you don't let them out of their rooms. It gets a bit more expensive when there are doctors, psycologists, drug counselors, employment and life-skills training, group therapy sessions, music lessons, and the like going on.
    What do you cut back?

    R.I.P. Cyrano and Roxanne.

  5. #14

    Default Re: Ill. faces 66 percent tax boost amid budget crisis

    Quote Originally Posted by M Richardson View Post
    The largest single portion of the state budget - something like 40%, is to K-12 education. Teachers, custodians, bus drivers, etc. providing services.
    Out of complete curiosity, how does California pay for schools? In Ohio, it is based on property taxes. When schools want more money they put a levy on the ballot and the people who live in that school district vote to raise their own taxes or vote the levy down. When a levy is voted down, the schools usually cut busing first in an attempt to piss off parents and get them to vote for the levy two months later. Rarely do they cut things out of a teacher unions contract to help out. A local radio station "outed" a school contract and made the union reps sound foolish on air when they tried to defend things like not paying a nickel for healthcare. There were several other simple cuts they could have made to the contract to save enough money to pay for the levy, but the teachers were unwilling.

    So, is that how Cali does it? Or is it income tax or something else?

  6. #15
    Super Moderator UGLY's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ill. faces 66 percent tax boost amid budget crisis

    Quote Originally Posted by M Richardson View Post
    Of COURSE 80% goes to payroll. Government doesn't provide widgits - it provides services. The parks are already there. The state is paying for people to maintain them. The roads are there. The state is paying for people to stand next to them leaning on shovels (sorry, couldn't resist). The largest single portion of the state budget - something like 40%, is to K-12 education. Teachers, custodians, bus drivers, etc. providing services.
    That money can be touched - just as soon as the people of California are willing to do without the services provided. Shut down the parks, or only open them on weekends. Put 40 kids in a classroom - and buy new books every 15 years instead of 7. Prisons are easy - go back to warehousing prisoners. It is really pretty easy for 2 staff to watch a couple of hundred prisoners if you don't let them out of their rooms. It gets a bit more expensive when there are doctors, psycologists, drug counselors, employment and life-skills training, group therapy sessions, music lessons, and the like going on.
    What do you cut back?
    The budget in CA in my understanding can not be changed without a ballot initiative. There has to be some concession somewhere. You tell me how CA is in such debt when they have all the money coming in. Now look at who is moving out of CA, it is the wealthiest people due to increases in tax. Naturaly if they take there money somewhere else then those left behind have to pick up the tab.

  7. #16

    Default Re: Ill. faces 66 percent tax boost amid budget crisis

    California used to pay for schooling through local funding. Somebody figured out that the wealthier neighborhoods had better schools than the poorer neighborhoods. So they decided it would be more equal to take the money out of the hands of the local community and send it to the state, where it would be divided up with a greater sense of equality. Please note I did not say equally. Then the state government figured out that if they took the education funds and put them into the general fund, they could siphon off education funds for their own special projects. Eventually the voters figured out that scam and passed an initiative requiring that at least (I think) 39% of the general fund had to be spent on education. That worked O.K. when the economy was thriving - but when the bottom fell out of things the rigidity of the budget requirement for education made it tough to make adjustments. The budget doesn't require an initiative for change. The problem has been with politicians that can't/won't make tough choices - to the point where voters got sick of it and started initiative processes to try to correct things. Of course, since that invariably wound up with special interest involvement, the initiative process didn't work either.
    California DOESN"T have all the money coming in. Tax revenue has shrunk over the last 8 or so years so badly that the state is scraping by. The biggest problem (from what I can figure out) is that when things got tough, our politicians folded. Instead of making tough decisions (cutting spending) they borrowed. Now they have maxed out the credit and are finally having to face reality. The squealing coming out of Sacramento is not a pleasant sound. The economic failure in CA is exacerbated by the anti-business laws that have been passed over the last 25 years. Businesses, especially manufacturing, have found it easier to move out of California than to deal with all of the regulation.

    R.I.P. Cyrano and Roxanne.

  8. #17
    Super Moderator UGLY's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ill. faces 66 percent tax boost amid budget crisis

    I am glad you posted that. I think we are on the same page

  9. #18
    Olympic Champ RYou's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ill. faces 66 percent tax boost amid budget crisis

    Quit yer complainin, Illinois doesn't even meet the US mean

    State and Local Tax Burdens: Highest to Lowest
    Personal Income, Sales, Gasoline and Property Taxes

    US Mean 9.7% (down from 10.3% in 1977)
    Illinois 9.3% (down from 9.9% in '77)
    New Jersey 11.8% (up from 11.1% in '77)
    New York 11.7% (down from 12.8% in '77)
    Connecticut 11.1% (up from 10.2% in '77)
    Maryland 10.8%
    Hawaii 10.6%
    California 10.5% (down from 11.6% in '77)
    Ohio 10.4%
    Vermont 10.3%
    Minnesota 10.2%
    Rhode Island 10.2%
    Pennsylvania 10.2%
    Wisconsin 10.2%
    Idaho 10.1%
    Arkansas 10.0%
    Maine 10.0%

    Source: The Tax Foundation
    Life's not the breaths you take, the breathing in and out that gets you through the day ain't what it's all about. It's the moments that take your breath away.

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