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Thread: How much is enough?

  1. #19
    Super Moderator UGLY's Avatar
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    Default Re: How much is enough?

    Quote Originally Posted by ban basketball View Post
    That was one of the points that I made in my post.

    This link shows that Congress was only half democrats. Democrats held only the House during the Reagan years, while republicans held the Senate and Presidency. http://arts.bev.net/roperldavid/politics/congress.htm
    As we have just seen with our recent democratic congress and president that numbers dont always man desired results.

    In order to get the dems to vote with the President on certain issues he had to go along with others, as always. Just like Clinton had to.

  2. #20
    Super Moderator UGLY's Avatar
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    Default Re: How much is enough?

    Ban,

    I also dont understand why you want to know how much profit is enough? There is no such thing. Those profits pay the bills and help them provide the goods. People are free to not purchase the goods if they dont like the company and there is always an alternative. More profits also means more taxable revenue.

    Instead of focusing on profits would it not be better to close loop holes and deductions.

    Also we are not talking about corporate tax, which is among the highest in the world. Just personal income tax. If you raise taxes on the corporations you can guarantee a rise in the cost of goods.

  3. #21

    Default Re: How much is enough?

    I am for a flat tax all around. The exact percentage, I would have to leave up to a group of economists to decide. I would like to see a combination of various different thinking economists get together to come up with a percentage.

    That will never happen, though. As far as raising taxes right now, I would have been okay with the Bush tax cuts to expire, if I trusted the government not to misspend the extra money. They have proven that it doesn't matter how much money the government gets, they will spend more than they have. Therefore, I cannot support any tax increase. I generally believe that individuals will do a better job for themselves than the government and it seems as though I am proven right everytime I turn on the news.

  4. #22
    World Champ ODH's Avatar
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    Default Re: How much is enough?

    Quote Originally Posted by UGLY View Post
    I was not trying to mix the tax and SS. I thought you said that they do pay those as taxes so I was trying to impliment those also. I was also refering to the claim that defense is 60% of the budget.
    I guess my question is about the stat that 50% pay no taxes. Does that not include SS & Medicare fees. I assume that it does not, but I don't know.

    Now the follow-up to that answer is if you take out SS and Medicare (which I guess are not funded by taxes) what percent is defense spending?

  5. #23
    World Champ ODH's Avatar
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    Default Re: How much is enough?

    Quote Originally Posted by quinn14 View Post
    I am for a flat tax all around. The exact percentage, I would have to leave up to a group of economists to decide. I would like to see a combination of various different thinking economists get together to come up with a percentage.

    That will never happen, though. As far as raising taxes right now, I would have been okay with the Bush tax cuts to expire, if I trusted the government not to misspend the extra money. They have proven that it doesn't matter how much money the government gets, they will spend more than they have. Therefore, I cannot support any tax increase. I generally believe that individuals will do a better job for themselves than the government and it seems as though I am proven right everytime I turn on the news.
    I agree that I think the Bush tax cuts should have expired across the board. It was clever repositioning that letting temporary tax cuts, that were supposed to provide a stimulus, expire would have been a tax increase.

    All the people who are up in arms about the deficit seem to be extremely quiet now. Do they all now believe in the Keyesnian modle of government borrowing to stimulate the economy?

  6. #24

    Default Re: How much is enough?

    Quote Originally Posted by UGLY View Post
    As we have just seen with our recent democratic congress and president that numbers dont always man desired results.

    In order to get the dems to vote with the President on certain issues he had to go along with others, as always. Just like Clinton had to.
    That's all well and good, but the question must always be asked that if revenues went up so dramatically during the Reagan years, then why was their such a budget shortfall, and why were taxes raised by Reagan so many times to offset these budget shortfalls?

    Again, the revenues simply weren't there.
    UNI Panthers...Because it's just right.

  7. #25

    Default Re: How much is enough?

    Quote Originally Posted by ODH View Post
    I agree that I think the Bush tax cuts should have expired across the board. It was clever repositioning that letting temporary tax cuts, that were supposed to provide a stimulus, expire would have been a tax increase.

    All the people who are up in arms about the deficit seem to be extremely quiet now. Do they all now believe in the Keyesnian modle of government borrowing to stimulate the economy?
    I see both sides to this issue. I can understand why businesses need the current tax rate to be extended. I also can see that our government needs more money to pay off the debt.

    The problem is that if we did let the tax rates expire and the government got more money, it wouldn't go to the debt. They would just use it to stop ADDING to the debt. And the money generated wouldn't completely stop them from adding to it.

    Once the government learns to spend within their means, I could support a tax increase. But that is not the situation right now. Letting the tax cuts expire wouldn't cover their expenditures because they haven't cut spending. The latest budget proposal showed that they have no intention of cutting ANY spending.

    This will never happen, but it would be nice if it did. How about we cut their salaries in half until they learn to spend within our means? Let's also cut their healthcare and require that they show up for House or Senate hearings on time or get docked in pay? How about making them vote for every single item up for vote or get docked? This is how the real world works. They are taking advantage of the job and it is time to change it. I think removing their pensions, healthcare and giving them term limits would help a whole lot. Once they have to live like the rest of us, maybe they will be more responsible.

  8. #26

    Default Re: How much is enough?

    Quote Originally Posted by UGLY View Post
    Ban,

    I also dont understand why you want to know how much profit is enough? There is no such thing. Those profits pay the bills and help them provide the goods. People are free to not purchase the goods if they dont like the company and there is always an alternative. More profits also means more taxable revenue.

    Instead of focusing on profits would it not be better to close loop holes and deductions.

    Also we are not talking about corporate tax, which is among the highest in the world. Just personal income tax. If you raise taxes on the corporations you can guarantee a rise in the cost of goods.
    It isn't profit, per se, it's the inequality that gets perpetuated from it.

    When CEO's today are earning literally 350 times the amount that your average American worker is earning, and the average American continues to spiral into greater debt because his/her inccome cannot provide a livelihood in today's economy, then we can say that there is a problematic aspect to profit that creates such inequality.

    It does our society ZERO good to have a middle class, where 75% of us reside, that cannot live on its income, but, rather, has to rely on going deeper and deeper in debt to buy goods. That is not a vibrant economy, and a good chunk of the reason why our economy has struggled for so long.
    UNI Panthers...Because it's just right.

  9. #27

    Default Re: How much is enough?

    Quote Originally Posted by ban basketball View Post
    When CEO's today are earning literally 350 times the amount that your average American worker is earning, and the average American continues to spiral into greater debt because his/her inccome cannot provide a livelihood in today's economy, then we can say that there is a problematic aspect to profit that creates such inequality.
    If you would include politicians when you say CEO's, then this agrument would hold more water for me. It is sooooo hypicritical for the same politicians who spent us into this national debt, claim to know what is best for business. They villify CEO's but do the same thing. If our government was a business, it would be the worst business in the history of the country. But politicians seem to think others don't know how to spend money. It is crazy. I don't think they should be telling anyone how to run a business or spend money until they can show that they are capable.

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