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Thread: Religion out of the Question Thread

  1. #235
    Super Moderator UGLY's Avatar
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    Default Re: Religion out of the Question Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by coachsparky View Post
    No I did not admit that there was not eternal life, show me where I said that. Salvation to me means simply life after death, and we will all enjoy that. You did without a doubt put words in my mouth, it is completely dishonest to claim otherwise. Go back and look, I have several time brought the loving God part of it up in the discussion. It is how I first got out of traditional Christianity by having the revelation, that if what I had been taught all my life that the Bible meant then I was better than God because I would never do such things to one of my children. Just do a little research and you will find my posts about that.
    You said if you went by the original greek meaning of the word you would have to say there was not eternal life, you then amended that by saying you dont take the bible literally, and then you go on in other posts to claim that we have to take the words as they are in simple english. Except where it suites you to look into the origin of the word.

  2. #236
    Super Moderator UGLY's Avatar
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    Default Re: Religion out of the Question Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by coachsparky View Post
    as in Adam all die, pretty clear that means because of Adam's all will die.

    so also in Christ, all will be made alive, pretty clear that means all will have eternal life because of Jesus' actions.

    How again do you claim the convoluted interpretation of that simple English should go?
    In Christ, in the belief of Christ as the Savior. I posted multiple verses where if you just let the simple english speak for itself said that you must believe in Christ to be saved. You gave three verses and you think they trump all others.

  3. #237

    Default Re: Religion out of the Question Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by UGLY View Post
    In Christ, in the belief of Christ as the Savior. I posted multiple verses where if you just let the simple english speak for itself said that you must believe in Christ to be saved. You gave three verses and you think they trump all others.
    In Adam must then mean you will not die unless you have belief in Adam, so you are saying anyone who does not have belief in Adam will not die. Sorry Ugly it does not work that way. If you did not have to "believe" in Adam to be one of the "ALL" to die, then you must not have to "believe" in Jesus to be one of that "ALL" that are saved.

  4. #238

    Default Re: Religion out of the Question Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by UGLY View Post
    So in certain areas it is right to interpret based on the context but in others we need to simply let the words speak for themselves and not take into account things like word origin or context of the situation or anything else.

    You are a seriously confused young man.

  5. #239

    Default Re: Religion out of the Question Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by UGLY View Post
    In Christ, in the belief of Christ as the Savior. I posted multiple verses where if you just let the simple english speak for itself said that you must believe in Christ to be saved. You gave three verses and you think they trump all others.
    Here are four more that show that the Bible teaches Universalism, not Exclusivism, now I have posted at least as many verses as you.

    <link rel="File-List" href="file:///C:%5CDOCUME%7E1%5CB5EDDREH%5CLOCALS%7E1%5CTemp%5Cm sohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml"><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:WordDocument> <w:View>Normal</w:View> <w:Zoom>0</w:Zoom> <w:PunctuationKerning/> <w:ValidateAgainstSchemas/> <w:SaveIfXMLInvalid>false</w:SaveIfXMLInvalid> <w:IgnoreMixedContent>false</w:IgnoreMixedContent> <w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText>false</w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText> <w:Compatibility> <w:BreakWrappedTables/> <w:SnapToGridInCell/> <w:WrapTextWithPunct/> <w:UseAsianBreakRules/> <wontGrowAutofit/> </w:Compatibility> <w:BrowserLevel>MicrosoftInternetExplorer4</w:BrowserLevel> </w:WordDocument> </xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:LatentStyles DefLockedState="false" LatentStyleCount="156"> </w:LatentStyles> </xml><![endif]--><style> <!-- /* Style Definitions */ p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal {mso-style-parent:""; margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";} h2 {mso-margin-top-alt:auto; margin-right:0in; mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto; margin-left:0in; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; mso-outline-level:2; font-size:18.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman"; font-weight:bold;} p {mso-margin-top-alt:auto; margin-right:0in; mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto; margin-left:0in; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";} @page Section1 {size:8.5in 11.0in; margin:1.0in 1.25in 1.0in 1.25in; mso-header-margin:.5in; mso-footer-margin:.5in; mso-paper-source:0;} div.Section1 {page:Section1;} --> </style><!--[if gte mso 10]> <style> /* Style Definitions */ table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para-margin:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-ansi-language:#0400; mso-fareast-language:#0400; mso-bidi-language:#0400;} </style> <![endif]--> 1 Timothy 4:10<o></o>

    <sup>10</sup>(and for this we labor and strive), that we have put our hope in the living God, who is the Savior of all men, and especially of those who believe.<o></o>

    1 John 2:2<o></o>

    <sup id="en-NIV-30537">2</sup>He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.<o>

    </o> Romans 11:32<o></o>

    <sup id="en-NIV-28227">32</sup>For God has bound all men over to disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all.<o></o>


    John 17:2<o>
    </o><o></o>
    <sup>2</sup>For you granted him authority over all people that he might give eternal life to all those you have given him.
    Last edited by coachsparky; 07-24-2010 at 09:01 AM.

  6. #240
    NCAA Champ WhippetGrappler's Avatar
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    Default Re: Religion out of the Question Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by coachsparky View Post
    Here are four more that show that the Bible teaches Universalism, not Exclusivism, now I have posted at least as many verses as you.

    <link rel="File-List" href="file:///C:%5CDOCUME%7E1%5CB5EDDREH%5CLOCALS%7E1%5CTemp%5Cm sohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml"><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:WordDocument> <w:View>Normal</w:View> <w:Zoom>0</w:Zoom> <w:PunctuationKerning/> <w:ValidateAgainstSchemas/> <w:SaveIfXMLInvalid>false</w:SaveIfXMLInvalid> <w:IgnoreMixedContent>false</w:IgnoreMixedContent> <w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText>false</w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText> <w:Compatibility> <w:BreakWrappedTables/> <w:SnapToGridInCell/> <w:WrapTextWithPunct/> <w:UseAsianBreakRules/> <wontGrowAutofit/> </w:Compatibility> <w:BrowserLevel>MicrosoftInternetExplorer4</w:BrowserLevel> </w:WordDocument> </xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml> <w:LatentStyles DefLockedState="false" LatentStyleCount="156"> </w:LatentStyles> </xml><![endif]--><style> <!-- /* Style Definitions */ p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal {mso-style-parent:""; margin:0in; margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";} h2 {mso-margin-top-alt:auto; margin-right:0in; mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto; margin-left:0in; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; mso-outline-level:2; font-size:18.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman"; font-weight:bold;} p {mso-margin-top-alt:auto; margin-right:0in; mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto; margin-left:0in; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:12.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";} @page Section1 {size:8.5in 11.0in; margin:1.0in 1.25in 1.0in 1.25in; mso-header-margin:.5in; mso-footer-margin:.5in; mso-paper-source:0;} div.Section1 {page:Section1;} --> </style><!--[if gte mso 10]> <style> /* Style Definitions */ table.MsoNormalTable {mso-style-name:"Table Normal"; mso-tstyle-rowband-size:0; mso-tstyle-colband-size:0; mso-style-noshow:yes; mso-style-parent:""; mso-padding-alt:0in 5.4pt 0in 5.4pt; mso-para-margin:0in; mso-para-margin-bottom:.0001pt; mso-pagination:widow-orphan; font-size:10.0pt; font-family:"Times New Roman"; mso-ansi-language:#0400; mso-fareast-language:#0400; mso-bidi-language:#0400;} </style> <![endif]--> 1 Timothy 4:10<o></o>

    <sup>10</sup>(and for this we labor and strive), that we have put our hope in the living God, who is the Savior of all men, and especially of those who believe.<o></o>

    1 John 2:2<o></o>

    <sup id="en-NIV-30537">2</sup>He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.<o>

    </o> Romans 11:32<o></o>

    <sup id="en-NIV-28227">32</sup>For God has bound all men over to disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all.<o></o>


    John 17:2<o>
    </o><o></o>
    <sup>2</sup>For you granted him authority over all people that he might give eternal life to all those you have given him.

    Sparky,
    What version are you quoting from?
    BRUTUS BUCKEYE WILL TAKE YOU DOWN...

  7. #241

    Default Re: Religion out of the Question Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by WhippetGrappler View Post
    Sparky,
    What version are you quoting from?
    The New International Version.

  8. #242
    Olympic Champ kr1963's Avatar
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    Default Re: Religion out of the Question Thread

    Something for those enjoy a good bump...

    Sometimes you have to ask yourself "Who was that person or being who was referring to himself as GOD..."?

    Sometimes the stories in the Bible don't match. Sometimes you have a benevolent Divine presence & other times a contradictory wrathful vengeful God. So if that alone makes you doubt your own spirituality I submit this series as one possible explanation....

    Btw this is the chapter in this video series called THE EVIDENCE & is PART 4 of 9 Parts. I believe it is chapter 3 in the series.


  9. #243
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    Default Re: Religion out of the Question Thread

    Why do people quote a book (the Bible) which did not exist when the Arian heresy first manifested itself? Constatine called the Council of Nicea to address the controversy, this was well before the Canon of Scripture was declared. See:

    http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/01707c.htm

    for a history of Arianism. It is a heresy of course

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