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Thread: Terrorist caught!

  1. #19

    Default Re: Terrorist caught!

    Quote Originally Posted by ODH View Post
    Hutaree militia is another example of home grown terrorist organization.
    They are being given their constitutional rights enve though they are accused of
    plotting to kill police officers as part of a plan to wage war against the government
    http://www.theatlanticwire.com/opini...-Decision-3470

    I don't believe that terrorist suspects should be treated any diffrent than any other defendent. I know they present a danger to society but so does an accussed child molester or multiple DWI offender.
    It is my understanding that those guys were American citizens and therefore are entitiled to American constitutional rights. Terrorists who are not citizens are not entitled to our constitutional rights. This last guy was a citizen, too, and therefore is entitled to our constitutional rights.

  2. #20

    Default Re: Terrorist caught!

    Quote Originally Posted by quinn14 View Post
    Terrorists who are not citizens are not entitled to our constitutional rights.
    Where in the constitution does is state than the rights it guarantees are only for US citizens?
    There's no such thing as a pretty good aligator wrestler.

  3. #21
    Super Moderator UGLY's Avatar
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    Default Re: Terrorist caught!

    Quote Originally Posted by FloggingSully View Post
    Where in the constitution does is state than the rights it guarantees are only for US citizens?
    Sully you seem to really dislike this idea. Let me ask you why our Constitution would apply to anyone else?

  4. #22

    Default Re: Terrorist caught!

    Quote Originally Posted by FloggingSully View Post
    Where in the constitution does is state than the rights it guarantees are only for US citizens?
    Maybe this will help. Notice the bolded part at the end.

    <table style="padding: 0px; margin: 0px;" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr><td style="border: 0px none; text-align: left; padding: 0px; margin: 0px; width: 100%; vertical-align: middle;" width="100%">Does the constitution protect citizens or all people living in the US?

    </td></tr></tbody></table>
    <!-- if no answer, let the user know how to contribute --><!-- display answer --><!-- google_ad_section_start -->Answer


    Excellent but difficult question. The Supreme Court interprets the Constitution, and there is a lot unsaid in the Constitution. It was not possible, nor was it the plan, for the Constitution to cover any possible issue that might arise.
    Article IV Section 2 says: The Citizens of each State shall be entitled to all Privileges and Immunities of Citizens in the several States. A Person charged in any State with Treason, Felony, or other Crime, who shall flee from Justice, and be found in another State, shall on demand of the executive Authority of the State from which he fled, be delivered up, to be removed in the State having Jurisdiction of the Crime.
    The 14th Amendment Paragraph 1 says: All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
    The Article IV material has to do with each state giving credit to the public acts of every other state. It makes specific reference to Citizens. The reference to non-citizens (A Person charged...) relates not to Privileges and Immunities, but to the States' rights to demand the return of anyone charged with a crime. The 14th Amendment defines citizenship. Again, the Supreme Court interprets the Constitution, it is not open to private interpretation. But it does appear that while any person in the US should enjoy basic rights that any person anywhere should have (Declaration), certain Privileges and Immunities seem to be reserved for citizens. This seems reasonable; the United States is a Sovereign State, and has the right and power (given by the People) to establish laws and enforce the rule of law. Privileges and Immunities of citizenship are not (and should not be) simply extended to anyone who crosses our borders. No nation on earth does that. <!-- google_ad_section_end -->
    Last edited by Schlottke; 05-05-2010 at 12:40 PM.

  5. #23

    Default Re: Terrorist caught!

    Obviously that didn't turn out the way I expected. Sorry for that. I didn't know how to edit it.

  6. #24
    Super Moderator UGLY's Avatar
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    Default Re: Terrorist caught!

    Quote Originally Posted by quinn14 View Post
    Obviously that didn't turn out the way I expected. Sorry for that. I didn't know how to edit it.
    THat was good I was just about to post Article IV Section 2, nice job.

  7. #25

    Default Re: Terrorist caught!

    Quote Originally Posted by UGLY View Post
    THat was good I was just about to post Article IV Section 2, nice job.
    Article IV Section 2 states that citzens will be given the rights of citizens, does it say which rights those are?

    The 14th ammendment specifically states that certain rights (voting) require citizenship, I don't see citizenship listed as a requirement in any of the 1st 10 ammendments, most of which have language that states they apply to everyone (e.g. Congress can't pass a law abridging free speech for non-citizens if they can't make any laws abridging free speech).
    There's no such thing as a pretty good aligator wrestler.

  8. #26

    Default Re: Terrorist caught!

    Quote Originally Posted by quinn14 View Post
    Maybe this will help. Notice the bolded part at the end.
    From your link:

    Q: Does the US Constitution apply only to citizens?

    A: No, the rights of both citizens and non-citizens are protected by the US Constitution. However, there are some right specifically reserved for citizens, such as the right to a Federal job and to vote.


    In actuality, the Constitution doesn't apply to "citizens," nor does it even apply to "people." It applies to the government. It tells the government what it can and can't do (the body tells the government what it can do, and the Bill of Rights tells it what it can't do).


    Immigration rules are administrative ones, and are mandated by Congress, not the courts.
    There's no such thing as a pretty good aligator wrestler.

  9. #27

    Default Re: Terrorist caught!

    Quote Originally Posted by FloggingSully View Post
    Article IV Section 2 states that citzens will be given the rights of citizens, does it say which rights those are?

    The 14th ammendment specifically states that certain rights (voting) require citizenship, I don't see citizenship listed as a requirement in any of the 1st 10 ammendments, most of which have language that states they apply to everyone (e.g. Congress can't pass a law abridging free speech for non-citizens if they can't make any laws abridging free speech).
    Considering that this is the US constitution and not the world constitution, the citizens they speak of are US citizens. That is obvious.

    And I agree that tourists who come over here should be protected by our constitution from being harmed by others. But, when that same person is the one inflicting the harm, then they don't have constitutional rights. Heck, I wouldn't even give them Miranda rights because courts cost money and so do court appointed attorneys. That is on our dime.

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