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Thread: Mark McGwire

  1. #19
    Super Moderator UGLY's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mark McGwire

    Quote Originally Posted by FloggingSully View Post
    The abilities of guys on steroids playing against other guys on steroids is not real, but the abilities of guys on amphetamines playing against other guys on amphetamines is real?
    We would need to determine how many people were on steroids in order to say that they were playing against other people who used steroids. Clearly not every major league player used and they were a banned substance. I say no HOF, especially if they dont let Pete Rose in.

  2. #20

    Default Re: Mark McGwire

    Quote Originally Posted by washed up wrestler View Post
    It's Obama's fault. He supplied the steroids and the syringes.
    Go away, or stay on topic at least.

  3. #21
    Super Moderator Zapp Brannigan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mark McGwire

    Quote Originally Posted by UGLY View Post
    We would need to determine how many people were on steroids in order to say that they were playing against other people who used steroids. Clearly not every major league player used and they were a banned substance. I say no HOF, especially if they dont let Pete Rose in.
    Bull. McGwire was denied entry to the Hall of Fame because it was ASSUMED he was on steroids. Same with Sosa. He never tested positive. There is no proof he cheated, just peoples assumptions. So yeah, the new, moral high-ground that baseball fans and writers watn to take strikes me as disingenuous.

    And don't give me that "old man" crap about "oh, these guys could never play with Mantle, and Killebrew".

    1. How do you know THEY weren't on steroids? You don't. Steroids existed back then, too.

    2. Mantle was a renowned alcoholic and partier. You're telling me he was able to perform at such a high level, consistently, on days after partying (which he did), without being on something? BS.
    Jacob Schlottke---Gone too soon, and the world is a little less bright because of it. RIP, brother.

    One, two, Evans is coming for you...

  4. #22
    Super Moderator UGLY's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mark McGwire

    Quote Originally Posted by Zapp Brannigan View Post
    Bull. McGwire was denied entry to the Hall of Fame because it was ASSUMED he was on steroids. Same with Sosa. He never tested positive. There is no proof he cheated, just peoples assumptions. So yeah, the new, moral high-ground that baseball fans and writers watn to take strikes me as disingenuous.

    And don't give me that "old man" crap about "oh, these guys could never play with Mantle, and Killebrew".

    1. How do you know THEY weren't on steroids? You don't. Steroids existed back then, too.

    2. Mantle was a renowned alcoholic and partier. You're telling me he was able to perform at such a high level, consistently, on days after partying (which he did), without being on something? BS.
    My point is, if they were to put these people in after they have admitted or have been proved to taken steroids, there would need to be a large majority of people also taking them, in order for there numbers to even be close to legit. IF there are only assumptions then I agree with you.

    I am sure that all of these players today could have played back then, I dont think that is even an argument.

    We dont they weren't on steroids but I think by judging there off season training regiments and their overall physical condition we can say they were not on steroids most likely.

    Many players have been able to play day after day while being either an alcoholic or drug addict or both, Daryl Strawberry and Doc Gooden come to mind.

  5. #23

    Default Re: Mark McGwire

    What about the players that we KNOW were taking "greenies" they were illegal and gave some players a distinct advantage. I'm sure not everyone used them but many did. Should they be allowed into the HOF? I don't see how taking steroids is a different form of cheating than greenies, spitballing, scuffing or anything else. If it's against the rules, it's against the rules. Either they (baseball writers) need to keep them ALL out or none of them.

    On a side note I'd love to see how many of these baseball writers that are now so enraged about the use of roids and hgh knew about it before Canseco book but didn't say anything about it. With as much time as some beat writers spend around the ballpark I'm sure that many of them knew about it.

  6. #24

    Default Re: Mark McGwire

    "And don't give me that "old man" crap about "oh, these guys could never play with Mantle, and Killebrew"."

    Sorry about that, but I'm not withdrawing the comment. You put them back in the fifties and sixties and they are NOT at the level of those stars. What they did was UNATURAL. I didn't make judgement choices THEN, on whether it was them, or the bats, or the balls, or a combination of all three. I just knew that what was happening was a perversion of baseball. It was creepy and the media hoopla was doubly sickening.

    I totally reject the idea that they saved baseball. That was thought up by some baseball writers who were stretching to dramatize events, while not having enough courage to ask the REAL questions that should have been asked. Baseball was their living and they didn't want to rock the boat to it's core by calling out the legitimacy of what was transpiring.

    Baseball is the greatest spectator sport ever, when presented in it's purest form. Now, that would be on the sandlots. There is nothing like a warm summer evening watching a well played game. When it's over you get up and sigh, wondering why it had to be over so quickly. It is so comfortable. There is nothing like it.

    Major league baseball is a perversion. It's been a long time since I was COMFORTABLE watching the major league game.

    I've given up.

    You guys do and think what you want.
    DSCH: a Soviet artist's reply to unjust criticism.

  7. #25
    Super Moderator Zapp Brannigan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Mark McGwire

    Quote Originally Posted by LkwdSteve View Post
    I totally reject the idea that they saved baseball. That was thought up by some baseball writers who were stretching to dramatize events, while not having enough courage to ask the REAL questions that should have been asked. Baseball was their living and they didn't want to rock the boat to it's core by calling out the legitimacy of what was transpiring.
    Sorry, but thems the facts. After the Strike, baseball attendance was down. Baseball ratings were down. McGwire and Sosa's chase brought people back.

    And come on about the reporters being afraid to ask the real questions. Today's athletes face FAR more scrutiny from the media. The Mick was, as described, an alcoholic and a late-night party machine, but nobody talked about it. Reporters didn't ask questions about amphetamines that they knew were rampant throughout the game.

    Remember when McGwire was questsioned about the Andro that was in his locker? That never would have happened in the 60's and 70's. These athletes face more scrutinization then the athletes your glorifying by huge amounts.
    Jacob Schlottke---Gone too soon, and the world is a little less bright because of it. RIP, brother.

    One, two, Evans is coming for you...

  8. #26

    Default Re: Mark McGwire

    Quote Originally Posted by FloggingSully View Post
    Admits to using steroids, also adds that water is wet.
    *spew*

  9. #27

    Default Re: Mark McGwire

    "the athletes your glorifying by huge amounts. "

    That's one of the problems with internet arguments. Exaggeration comes about quite often.

    You are seriously telling me that I am overglorifying Mays, Mantle, Robinson, and Aaron?

    How can they be OVERGLORIFIED?

    My point remains. What Sammie baby and Markie baby did was unnatural. Period.

    If the public didn't realize, or at least SENSE, that something was rotten at home plate, that's on them.
    DSCH: a Soviet artist's reply to unjust criticism.

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