SL, if top dollar is your goal, and you have the talent, private is the way to go.
I'm no expert on this, so I could be wrong, but my sense is all the big dollar jobs go a very few, perhaps the top 3% of the law classes. To me, aspiring to be a big firm lawyer (with the salary thereunto pertaining, and the 80 hour work weeks) is like aspiring to be a professional athlete. You may be good, but unless you are really, really good, it's not a realistic expectation. Did you see what NY Times said starting IRS attorneys were getting? 65-70K. Doesn't sound too bad to me.
Unfortunately, many students today acquire huge debt loads that they have to deal with after school.
Actually, I have no interest in being in a big firm anyway. I may be forced to go private firm to be able to pay for my loans, but at those big firms, you get crapped on for at least three years while you do all the grunt work. After three years, THEN you will be allowed to sit third or second chair. You have to be there at least 5 years before you get to be a lead attorney on a case. Sorry, but that holds no personal interest for me, especially since I don't plan on being a lawyer beyond the age of 40 at the latest.
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SL, if top dollar is your goal, and you have the talent, private is the way to go.
I'm no expert on this, so I could be wrong, but my sense is all the big dollar jobs go a very few, perhaps the top 3% of the law classes. To me, aspiring to be a big firm lawyer (with the salary thereunto pertaining, and the 80 hour work weeks) is like aspiring to be a professional athlete. You may be good, but unless you are really, really good, it's not a realistic expectation. Did you see what NY Times said starting IRS attorneys were getting? 65-70K. Doesn't sound too bad to me.
Unfortunately, many students today acquire huge debt loads that they have to deal with after school.
Matclone, I was just providing you w/ the information on which I made my claims. As far as the top three percent thing goes, I believe that the average starting salary (private) of any of the top fifteen schools is about 135,000 dollars. So you do not need to be in the top three percent of your class to get a big dollar job, although it certainly wouldn't hurt. That said, to get into these schools you are probably going to have scored in the top five percent of for the LSAT (165 or above) if not better so maybe that is what you mean (Grades, etc. included).
I do not disagree with you about the desirability of these jobs, but like you said the debt is huge and it would be hard not to take the jobs when you have just got done paying 40,000 some odd dollars intuition plus living expenses. The 65-75K IRS jobs pay will put you in a position not to have your tuition reimbursed (most of the reimbursement programs require that you be making less than 50,000 dollars) so, as I have been saying, people face an unfortunate dilemma.
Sorry to interfere in your "top dollar" discussion but isn't $135K per year for 80 hours per week is only $67.5K for 40 hours? Doesn't seem like a huge salary to me. You can simply work two jobs and make the same.
I think the way to go is to become an assistant of some very good private lawyer and make your name that way to later receive large projects yourself. But, what do I know?
Sorry to interfere in your "top dollar" discussion but isn't $135K per year for 80 hours per week is only $67.5K for 40 hours? Doesn't seem like a huge salary to me. You can simply work two jobs and make the same.
I think the way to go is to become an assistant of some very good private lawyer and make your name that way to later receive large projects yourself. But, what do I know?
i think 80 hours a week is a bit exaggerated for those 135 K jobs, but i do not have evidence to back that up unfortunately. I also believe that at some places you can get 100% bonuses -- my gf's cousin is in a job like that (100K base, but if you are doing good enough work not to get fired you can get those huge bonuses especially when things go well).
SL, most states have but one or two law schools, none of which are in the "top 15" (by whose standard?). I expect, but don't know, that the top students at those schools often go to the top firms in their states. The really big cities like LA, Chicago, and especially NYC, are in a different world, and probably attract many of the students from those schools you call the top 15.
I don't know if the 80-hour work week at the big firm is real, but that's the story I've heard repeated time and time again. I assume by his comments that Zapp has heard this too. Big's idea about how to do it sounds reasonable to me, but it is just one of many options.
I guess my argument boils down to this: money isn't everything. But I'm a bit of an idealist, and I know we all have different interests and callings in life.
Put it this way...money doesn't come with you when you leave, and I've lived all of my life very comfortably in the middle class. A loving family is a necessity (to me, I mean), lots of money is a luxury that I'll be ok if it doesn't come.
I just want to make enough money so I can help my Dad retire, and provide for my own family. 80 hour work weeks do not appeal to me. Work to live, don't live to work.
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"I've made it with a woman. Inform the men."
I guess my argument boils down to this: money isn't everything. But I'm a bit of an idealist, and I know we all have different interests and callings in life.
Like I said before, I do not disagree with you about the desirability of these jobs. My "dream job" would be a professorship. This dream of mine has the NFL-long shot odds you referred to since one has to distinguish his or herself in extremely competitive environments (prestigious school or schools if you go ahead and get an advanced degree, firm or clerkship, and in law reviews.) For the credentials you have to acquire, you could get a much higher paying job at a firm, but that is just fine with me. Maybe I am not idealistic, but I do not think you have to be to prefer lower-paying jobs when they offer more free-time, intellectual stimulation and work that is not centered on profit.
As for the top schools, it is true most states don't have a top fifteen school. In those states, a degree from the state school can be just as good as a degree from a higher ranked school out of the state. For most jobs here in Wisconsin, I could go to UW and be just fine. In fact, as was told to me by a few lawyers and partners, if I went to a more selective school like Berkeley it really wouldn't help me in WI b/c people hiring here went to UW, and have a better idea of what my grades/ class standing and internships reflect.
That said, there are reasons, good and bad, that some schools are considered better than others. Here are rankings done my academics that seem reasonable to me, and the top schools in different areas are all pretty much the same schools with a few exceptions:
I am not a fan of these sorts of rankings for the basic reason they may not reflect your needs or interests. As you point out, U of W is highly regarded in your state yet they are not on someone's ranked list. I'm sure Marquette is well regarded too (or at least was before we had rankings). If you want to be a professor, however, the school you go to may have some bearing.
Re: Another semester in the books! 
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