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Thread: Is Brock Lesnar Really the Best Pound-for-Pound Heavyweight in the UFC?

  1. #1
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    Star Is Brock Lesnar Really the Best Pound-for-Pound Heavyweight in the UFC?

    I know this may seem like a ridiculous statement to many, but at the same time it definitely has some validity: Is Brock Lesnar really the UFC's best pound-for-pound heavyweight?



    Brock Lesnar vs. Frank Mir

    Leading into the Mir-Lesnar fight, there was a lot of talk. Most of the talk was about how Mir was more technical and a better all-around mixed martial artist, but Lesnar was a better wrestler, and, oh yeah, he is much bigger.

    To summarize what that means...basically, “pound for pound,” Mir was a better fighter.

    Still, many people watching UFC 100 didn’t give Mir a chance. It didn’t matter if they were new to the sport of longtime viewers. Lesnar just looked too big; he looked like too much to overcome.

    Many hardcore fans tried to argue that Mir’s technical skills gave him the advantage against Lesnar. They said he had more than a chance to prevail, but I (along with many others) saw the size differential as too much to overcome.

    Mir came into the fight at 245 pounds, while Lesnar walked into the ring, on fight night, at 280-plus.

    That is quite a differential. That differential helped lead to his domination of Mir and it will help him continue to dominate, especially when he fights the heavyweight division's much smaller fighters.

    I know a lot of people will say “tough luck”; that is part of being a heavyweight. They are not flawed in that statement. According to the rules, Lesnar is undoubtedly the best heavyweight fighter the UFC has to offer.

    But...is he the UFC’s best heavyweight pound for pound?



    What Is a Pound-for-Pound Champ?

    In an era where everyone debates the top pound-for-pound fighters, where are the limits drawn?

    We already know that Georges St-Pierre, Anderson Silva, B.J. Penn, and Fedor Emelianenko are looked at as some of the best in the world, pound for pound. These rankings have been earned because each of these fighters have gone out and dominated their respective weight class.

    Is domination of a weight class the only criteria, though?

    A Penn vs. GSP “super fight” was supposed to move Penn up the pound-for-pound rankings. A win by Penn would prove to the world he had the best ratio of skill to weight.

    Penn lost that fight, though, and it wasn’t even close; still, Penn is considered one of the best in the world pound for pound. Some still rank him above GSP.

    I guess there is no shame in losing to someone who is a full weight class bigger than you.

    GSP outweighs Penn by 15 pounds.

    Lesnar outweighs Mir by 35-plus pounds.

    Is it possible Mir is a better pound-for-pound fighter? Does this make sense in the same weight class?

    Lesnar beat Couture and, at the time, he outweighed Couture by 60-plus pounds.

    Is it possible that Couture was also a better pound-for-pound fighter?



    History and Logic

    I have discussed this in a previous article about Brock Lesnar and his size. I proposed that he isn’t a truly a heavyweight—he's one of the first true super heavyweights.

    A lot of people didn’t agree with me, but I stand by what I said.

    My statements are not declaring Lesnar as any sort of fraud, or as anything but a champion, but I think this is the way the sport is going.

    MMA is becoming more and more popular every day. More popularity means more money. More money means more fighters. More fighters means there will be more monsters, with skill, that are cutting to 265.

    Where does that leave people the size of Frank Mir? Should he be expected to fight and win against people that outweigh him by 40 pounds? Or would most people his size disappear?

    I know it happened back in the early days, but the sport has changed a lot since then. Every MMA fighter has to become an expert in multiple techniques. It is just the evolution of the sport.

    Everywhere else in the UFC, fighters who are too small for their weight class drop down.

    Examples of this are: Randy Couture (lightheavy), Kenny Florian, Rashad Evan, Diego Sanchez, Sean Sherk, Michael Bisping, Wanderlei Silva, and many more.



    Solution

    I think a move should be made to create a new weight class, or, in essence, cut the heavyweight class in half.

    If the cut–off for heavyweight was 230 pounds, we could see fights between the likes of Big Nog, Mir, Couture, Cro Cop, Junior Dos Santos, Cain Velasquez and other fighters that can cut to that size.

    This creates lots of interesting matchups and ones that aren’t going to be as one-sided as Brock vs. any one of the above names.

    Then we could see super heavyweights like Brock Lesnar fight people that may actually have a reasonable chance of beating him. Match him up with and Shane Carwin, Tim Hague, Heath Herring, Mike Wessell, or, heck, maybe go get Bobby Lashley to make it interesting. Plus I’m sure TUF 10 will probably add a few names to the mix.

    The new breed of super heavyweights is not a bunch Tim Silvia clones; this is a whole different animal. These guys are a new kind of MMA athlete.

    Let Lesnar pick on people his own size.

    There is an added perk to this move, too—well, for the UFC, anyway. The UFC gets another title out of the deal. We all know how hard it is to hype up any PPV without a title on the line; well, this gives them one more belt. One more belt means two or three more main events a year.

    Right now it is just an idea, and I believe eventually it will become a need.

    It wasn’t that long ago that the lightweight division was looked at as silly. Now there are quality fights in the featherweight, bantamweight, and flyweight classes. Times have changed.

    Times will continue to change, and I believe this in the next step.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Is Brock Lesnar Really the Best Pound-for-Pound Heavyweight in the UFC?

    You are right it is ridiculous.

  3. #3
    National Finalist leglace's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is Brock Lesnar Really the Best Pound-for-Pound Heavyweight in the UFC?

    I say cut it at 225. That gives you a good 20 pounds between 205, and may push a couple more guys into HWT. We would not want to limit the talent pool to 5 fighters.

    145 - For Urijah's sake and maybe Frank Edgar...
    155
    170
    185
    205 - 20 lbs up from middleweight
    225 - 20 lbs up from light heavy. I'd like to see Cain here.
    HWT - limit 275 (up 10 more pounds so Mocco could get on board...)

  4. #4

    Default Re: Is Brock Lesnar Really the Best Pound-for-Pound Heavyweight in the UFC?

    The heavyweight division is already very thin and now we're going to break it up into two halves? Heavy weight means heavyweight.
    Lets go Brent!

  5. #5
    National Finalist leglace's Avatar
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    Default Re: Is Brock Lesnar Really the Best Pound-for-Pound Heavyweight in the UFC?

    I usually walk around at 215 and 220. I would certainly not consider myself a heavyweight. The 225 pound limit would really benefit guys like Buentello, Berry, and Velazquez as an example. We would also not have to see Mark Coleman so sucked out.

    There are plenty of true heavies. Dana just doesn't have them all. Noteables:

    Yvel, Barnett, Bigfoot Silva, Herman, Del Rosario, Oveream, Werdum, Rogers, Lashley, Rothwell.
    Silvia and Arlovski are both damaged stock at the moment. However, they are also reall hwts.

    Add them to true UFC hwts like Kongo, Gonzaga, Herring, Carwin, Russow (new acquire), Hague, Hardonk, Dos Santos, and Lesnar and you have some big dudes.

    The new reality show should also add a load of true hwts.
    Last edited by leglace; 07-15-2009 at 12:24 AM.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Is Brock Lesnar Really the Best Pound-for-Pound Heavyweight in the UFC?

    Yea, they defintely need to split it. Call the new one "heavyweight" and the next one "super-heavyweight". I see guys weighing 220 in HW that fight guys like 30lbs heavier than them.
    TRAIN LIKE A MADMAN!

  7. #7

    Default Re: Is Brock Lesnar Really the Best Pound-for-Pound Heavyweight in the UFC?

    "Leading into the Mir-Lesnar fight, there was a lot of talk. Most of the talk was about how Mir was more technical and a better all-around mixed martial artist, but Lesnar was a better wrestler, and, oh yeah, he is much bigger.

    To summarize what that means...basically, “pound for pound,” Mir was a better fighter.

    Still, many people watching UFC 100 didn’t give Mir a chance. It didn’t matter if they were new to the sport of longtime viewers. Lesnar just looked too big; he looked like too much to overcome.

    Many hardcore fans tried to argue that Mir’s technical skills gave him the advantage against Lesnar. They said he had more than a chance to prevail, but I (along with many others) saw the size differential as too much to overcome.

    Mir came into the fight at 245 pounds, while Lesnar walked into the ring, on fight night, at 280-plus.

    That is quite a differential. That differential helped lead to his domination of Mir and it will help him continue to dominate, especially when he fights the heavyweight division's much smaller fighters."





    Dont be fooled. This video shows the outstanding technique that Brock used in order to out position and eventually take Mir apart. See for yourselves

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fIDmN...layer_embedded
    Lets go Brent!

  8. #8

    Default Re: Is Brock Lesnar Really the Best Pound-for-Pound Heavyweight in the UFC?

    there are two strategies that form the foundation of most successful half guard attacks:

    1. Being on your side, facing your opponent, and
    2. Getting your body under his center of gravity
    Now in the fight Frank Mir was basically never able to apply either strategy, and it wasn't only Brock's physical attributes that shut down Frank Mir's half guard game. There was a lot of deliberate technique there too!

    Brock deliberately kept Frank on his back and/or facing away from him, and also didn't let him get under his center of gravity.

    How did he do this? At various times in the fight Brock used the following techniques and tactics:

    • He stiff armed his neck (keeping Frank away),
    • He pinned the head and moved his body back
    • He turned the head away with his forearm
    • He secured the far underhook and applied chest pressure
    • He used his head to grind into Frank's jaw, and drive into the chest and armpit
    • He grabbed the far armpit to turn Frank's face away and place it directly in the line of fire
    Finally, when Frank tried again to turn in at the very end of the fight, Brock let him turn, and secured the far wrist. The brutal flurry of unanswered blows that ended the fight came right afterwards...

    Stephan Kesting
    The Grappling Tips Newsletter
    Lets go Brent!

  9. #9

    Default Re: Is Brock Lesnar Really the Best Pound-for-Pound Heavyweight in the UFC?

    Using his head into the jaw and grabbing that armpit was brutal.
    "All that we are is the result of what we have thought. The mind is everything. What we think we become."

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