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Thread: GM could still fall despite gov.bailout

  1. #46
    Super Moderator UGLY's Avatar
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    Default Re: GM could still fall despite gov.bailout

    Sorry I missrepresented what I meant, I meant the government is losing money on its still large investment of GM, not the loan and they stand to lose money on that portion of the bailout.

    Also I had read that chrysler took a 300 million dollar loss in the second quarter of 2011, but your right they seem to be doing better now.

  2. #47

    Default Re: GM could still fall despite gov.bailout

    Quote Originally Posted by UGLY View Post
    He appointed the CEO.

    I could also pile on Chrystler but they paid back their gov. loan. I would rag on Ford but they are profitable and they didnt take any money. So that only leaves one and thats GM. Even though Chrystler is now struggling again as we knew it would at least they paid back the loan. So I dont hope for any american company to fail but I know taht in business sometimes it happens and it isnt the governments job to prevent it by giving them tax payer money. Also as Quinn pointed out many of the foriegn car companies make a large amount of vehivles here in the states, like the VW I drive. The jeep I drive was assembled in Mexico.
    But is IS the gubment's job to give taxpayer money to banks when they bankrupt the world, to car companies that manufacture in other countries, and to corporations and other businesses in the form of corporate welfare though, eh? That is DEFINITELY gubment's job.

    Yeah, that makes sense...
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  3. #48
    Super Moderator UGLY's Avatar
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    Default Re: GM could still fall despite gov.bailout

    Quote Originally Posted by ban basketball View Post
    But is IS the gubment's job to give taxpayer money to banks when they bankrupt the world, to car companies that manufacture in other countries, and to corporations and other businesses in the form of corporate welfare though, eh? That is DEFINITELY gubment's job.

    Yeah, that makes sense...
    I never said any of that and I would think that you know that is a misrepresentation of my stance on the issue, which you like to try and do from time to time. I did not agree with the bank bail out, however I do believe that it was a necessary evil to prevent the depending of the recession into a depression. I also believe that all of the banks have paid back those funds. I agree it wasn't the job of the gov. to give money to the auto companies, which I have clearly stated time and again I have no idea what you are getting at there. And as I have said before I am for eliminating all tax loopholes and certain deduction while lowering all tax rates, so again I dont know how your comment applies to me. I know your against corporate welfare, I would then assume you are against subsidies to GE for its green energy and all farm subsidies, which is basically welfare

  4. #49
    World Champ ODH's Avatar
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    Default Re: GM could still fall despite gov.bailout

    Quote Originally Posted by ban basketball View Post
    According to the data I provided earlier, it looks like Chrysler is entirely operating in the black. Not sure what you're talking about there.

    As for GM, looks like some Fox facts are clouding the reality here again. Yes, they DID pay back the loan with other TARP funds that they didn't use. FactCheck.org : General Motors’ Debt



    So, when are the big banks going to pay us back from the bailout money that "president" George C- Bush gave them? Are you also hoping for those major banks to fail too? If not, why not?
    My understanding is that taxpayers made money on the bank bailout and almost all of the banks a their loans back with interest. Probalby should do a little more research on this.

  5. #50

    Default Re: GM could still fall despite gov.bailout

    Quote Originally Posted by UGLY View Post
    I never said any of that and I would think that you know that is a misrepresentation of my stance on the issue, which you like to try and do from time to time. I did not agree with the bank bail out, however I do believe that it was a necessary evil to prevent the depending of the recession into a depression. I also believe that all of the banks have paid back those funds. I agree it wasn't the job of the gov. to give money to the auto companies, which I have clearly stated time and again I have no idea what you are getting at there. And as I have said before I am for eliminating all tax loopholes and certain deduction while lowering all tax rates, so again I dont know how your comment applies to me. I know your against corporate welfare, I would then assume you are against subsidies to GE for its green energy and all farm subsidies, which is basically welfare
    My point was asking why you are so angry at the specific GM bailout, while not being as angry at the bank bailouts, which (1) had a FAR, FAR greater impact on society than did GM and (2) was caused by deliberate deception and the betting on people to fail on their mortgages, all for bank bonuses. There shouldn't be any comparison of where your anger should be directed, especially when you look at the impact of the two scenarios.

    As for my stance on welfare, it's simple. If you get any sort of handout or assistance from gubment (EVERYONE does), then it should (1) all be equally ridiculed for those that oppose it and (2) should all be equally chopped when programs go on the chopping block. The fact is, we cut nothing with corporate and upper class welfare, but we cut the hell out of assistance programs for the poor; "class warfare" at it's finest.
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  6. #51

    Default Re: GM could still fall despite gov.bailout

    Quote Originally Posted by ODH View Post
    My understanding is that taxpayers made money on the bank bailout and almost all of the banks a their loans back with interest. Probalby should do a little more research on this.
    All well and good, but so have most of the car companies. Why the anger at GM, yet the banks are forgiven?

    Hmmm...
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  7. #52
    World Champ ODH's Avatar
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    Default Re: GM could still fall despite gov.bailout

    It is funny that the bailouts still create so much controversy. There are essentially zero politicians who liked them. They held their noses and voted for them despite their objections because they thought it was the best thing for the country even though they knew they would take a beating politically for their vote. This includes both Democrats and Republicans and Bush and Obama. Now that the bailouts turned out to be successful they are held out as evidence of everything that is wrong with our system, while I see it as an example of something that the government did well.

    The bailouts worked! Economic Armageddon was avoided at essentially no net loss to the government. And if you believe the experts financial collapse was a real possibility.

  8. #53
    Super Moderator UGLY's Avatar
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    Default Re: GM could still fall despite gov.bailout

    Quote Originally Posted by ban basketball View Post
    My point was asking why you are so angry at the specific GM bailout, while not being as angry at the bank bailouts, which (1) had a FAR, FAR greater impact on society than did GM and (2) was caused by deliberate deception and the betting on people to fail on their mortgages, all for bank bonuses. There shouldn't be any comparison of where your anger should be directed, especially when you look at the impact of the two scenarios.

    As for my stance on welfare, it's simple. If you get any sort of handout or assistance from gubment (EVERYONE does), then it should (1) all be equally ridiculed for those that oppose it and (2) should all be equally chopped when programs go on the chopping block. The fact is, we cut nothing with corporate and upper class welfare, but we cut the hell out of assistance programs for the poor; "class warfare" at it's finest.
    Trust me I did not want to save the banks and I thought we should not bail them out because of their mistakes, along with the governments hand in it, but in order to avoid a furthering of the financial crisis it had to be done, I didnt like it and I still dont like it. Sometimes you just have to take you medicine and thats what I had to do then. I will tell I have stopped banking with big banks directly anyway and opened an account at a very small credit union. The Government should have also mandated that loans be made after the bailout. That loans be made to people that were credit worthy and not allowed the banks to get fat and rich off of the loan and hoard the money. So I agree with you to a point.

  9. #54

    Default Re: GM could still fall despite gov.bailout

    Quote Originally Posted by UGLY View Post
    That loans be made to people that were credit worthy
    Exactly. That WAS the heart of the issue and the collapse. The more likely that you were to default on a loan, the bigger bonus that the bank and lenders got, and the more likely that the lenders would prey on such high risk borrowers.

    That, alone, is the biggest call and need for regulation that anyone should see.
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