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Thread: Seperate but unequal=growing chasm between rich and poor in America

  1. #28

    Default Re: Seperate but unequal=growing chasm between rich and poor in America

    Quote Originally Posted by quinn14 View Post
    Keep it real Ban. There isn't one rule or law in the history of the world that has a 100% success rate. People ARE slipping through the cracks. There aren't enough government workers to monitor everyone. People lie, steal and cheat. It is a flaw of humanity. To say that the American government can make sure that "nothing gets through the cracks under the current system!" is more comical than you meant it to be.
    Sure there is! Through the electronic system ansd through case workers.

    I can assure you that when the laws were changed in 1997, it made it virtually impossible to abuse the system today. If, for no other reason, the system requires that you either work or go to school to collect welfare today. No more sitting and home and getting a check. Hasn't been that way since 1997.

    Now, tell me the monitoring system that we have for corporate welfare cheats.
    UNI Panthers...Because it's just right.

  2. #29

    Default Re: Seperate but unequal=growing chasm between rich and poor in America

    Quote Originally Posted by UGLY View Post
    Ban I agree with you that corporations dont pay taxes. The reason they dont pay taxes is different for each of us. I believe they dont pay taxes because taxes are a cost of business that must be recouped and in order to do so they pass that cost onto the consumer as they do with all of their operating cost. You believe that they actually dont pay taxes which is a farce and I dont think you could prove that any corporation does not pay taxes.

    Question if lower corporate tax rates hurt an economy why is Germany lowering theirs and why do tehy have the healthiest economy in the world?

    I am not for subsidies or hand outs so we can agree on that but the fact remains that the more it costs a company to do business in America the less they will do it, the less they will pay their employees and the less they will hire.
    Take your pick of article that you'd like to read. http://www.google.com/#hl=en&sugexp=...2ea6e12edc6080

    Lowering corporate tax rates are great, but that's all that we've done for 50 years in this country. The burden has shifted onto you and I. Meanwhile, our wages have either declined or remained stagnant, we've lost benefits, job security, and continue to go deeper in debt.

    If that's good for all of us, please let me know how.
    UNI Panthers...Because it's just right.

  3. #30
    Super Moderator UGLY's Avatar
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    Default Re: Seperate but unequal=growing chasm between rich and poor in America

    None of those articles that I read actually named a company they just speculated and since the corporations are not required to disclose that info we really dont know, its kind of like your "until you see a memo from the brass" argument with fox news. There is speculation I am sure and even more none of the articles said that the corporations never paid taxes it was in one or two year incraments.

    I can tell you this it costs a company more to do business here than it does in other coutries. We have I believe the highest or second highest corporate tax rate in the world. How do you think the corporations would recoup the cost of taxes or do you think they just eat the cost?
    Last edited by UGLY; 02-27-2011 at 07:48 PM.

  4. #31

    Default Re: Seperate but unequal=growing chasm between rich and poor in America

    Quote Originally Posted by UGLY View Post
    None of those articles that I read actually named a company they just speculated and since the corporations are not required to disclose that info we really dont know, its kind of like your "until you see a memo from the brass" argument with fox news. There is speculation I am sure and even more none of the articles said that the corporations never paid taxes it was in one or two year incraments.

    I can tell you this it costs a company more to do business here than it does in other coutries. We have I believe the highest or second highest corporate tax rate in the world. How do you think the corporations would recoup the cost of taxes or do you think they just eat the cost?
    Well, then, that proves it: the articles and the study/report are wrong because you say so. My bad. Are there any facts that you cannot convolute? Seriously. Why would you want to deny such a thing? You like that they pay no taxes, yet you do? Why cover for them?

    About the memo, is there a report somewhere that says that other news networks are doing this? Poor analogy...

    If our corporate tax rate is SO high, why isn't every U.S. company locating overseas? Why do other companies come here to do their business (Toyota)?

    This is tedious. There's no sense in arguing with someone who doesn't even acknolwege facts, for God's sake.

    Folks like you make Marx look like a genius (false consciousness).
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  5. #32
    Super Moderator UGLY's Avatar
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    Default Re: Seperate but unequal=growing chasm between rich and poor in America

    I dont acknowledge what facts? Did you acknowledge that the entitlements are the single largest driver of the deficit. Did you acknowledge that all corporate taxes are passed on either the consumer in the form of higher prices or recouped from the workers in the form of lower wages and benefits?

    In one of the articles the claim was that exxon was paying no tax, then later in the article a representative of exxon said they were paying a large sum of money in taxes. I dont think that companies pay absolutely zero in tax, for any extended period of time if at all. These were the articles you said to choose from.

    Its people like you that get out a calculator and do the math and the math is right. What you fail to do is account for any backlash from the actions taken that would more than likely hurt the economy and jobs, simply based on the FACT that all companies have to recoup all of their costs.

  6. #33
    World Champ ODH's Avatar
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    Default Re: Seperate but unequal=growing chasm between rich and poor in America

    Quote Originally Posted by ban basketball View Post
    [Present Social Welfare Laws (into effect in 1997)<O


    1. Five year lifetime limit on TANF (Temporary Assistance for Needy Families).

    2. All TANF recipients must either be working or in school within a certain time period to receive assistance.

    3. Legal(not illegal) immigrants are barred from TANF and food stamps until they have been in the <st1:country-region w:st="on"><ST1U.S. for 5 years.</st1:country-region>
    Thank you this information Ban.
    I knew there was a significant change in the welfacre rules under Clinton, but didn't know all the details.
    Last edited by ODH; 02-27-2011 at 09:14 PM.

  7. #34
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    Default Re: Seperate but unequal=growing chasm between rich and poor in America

    Quote Originally Posted by quinn14 View Post
    I think tax breaks for business is good and I'm not saying that because of anyone on Fox news or anything like that. It just makes sense that if I owned a company, I could sell my products for less money if I didn't need to pay taxes. Companies don't really pay taxes no matter how much you charge them. They just raise the price of their product and the consumer covers it. So really, the common man pays corporate taxes. I'm pretty sure everyone knows that, but it sounds good to say if you are a politician that "evil corporate America" will pay more if you vote for them.
    Tax breaks for businesses are usually bad because they favor one business or one type of business over another. A classic example was 20 years or so ago mazda was looking to locate a car factory in the US and a town in Michigan offered huge tax breaks at the same time exisitn US car plants in the same town had to pay their fair share of taxes.
    Another example is agriculture. Why do farms get huge subsidies, while 9for the most part) manufacturing companies don't.

  8. #35
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    Default Re: Seperate but unequal=growing chasm between rich and poor in America

    Quote Originally Posted by UGLY View Post
    None of those articles that I read actually named a company they just speculated and since the corporations are not required to disclose that info we really dont know, its kind of like your "until you see a memo from the brass" argument with fox news. There is speculation I am sure and even more none of the articles said that the corporations never paid taxes it was in one or two year incraments.

    I can tell you this it costs a company more to do business here than it does in other coutries. We have I believe the highest or second highest corporate tax rate in the world. How do you think the corporations would recoup the cost of taxes or do you think they just eat the cost?
    The nominal coporate tax rate is high the US, but of one hte reasons is that there are so many tax loopholes.
    Coporate tax reform makes sense if it is revenue nuetral. Lower the nominal tax rate and close all the loopholes.

  9. #36
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    Default Re: Seperate but unequal=growing chasm between rich and poor in America

    Quote Originally Posted by UGLY View Post
    I dont acknowledge what facts? Did you acknowledge that the entitlements are the single largest driver of the deficit. Did you acknowledge that all corporate taxes are passed on either the consumer in the form of higher prices or recouped from the workers in the form of lower wages and benefits?

    ...
    I disagree with with this oversimplification. Coporations can only pass certain costs onto the consumer other ones they have to absorb abd if they want to stay profitable they have to make their whole business more efficient. That is the beauty of a market driven economy.

    For instance, Ford cannot charge more for the cars jsut because the coporate taxes are higher in the US than they are in Germany or Japan. They can only charge what the consumer will pay.

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