A question concerning the Double Grapevine (a.k.a. Saturday Night Ride)

[DoubleGrapevine]

Sorry to post such a banal thread, but as you could tell from the name, I'm interested in the pinning technique known as the "double grapevine" (also known as the "Saturday night ride"). I was just wondering, how common is the double grapevine on the high school level? on the college level? and in freestyle? Is it a junk move?

Wrestlers, is it still pretty effective for the pin or can it be countered? I've seen it done a few times, and it looks like once the double grapevine is in there is no way out. It looks like it would be a favorite move of many to get the fall since the other guy usually can't post his legs and bridge out. It also looks pretty painful. Is it?

I'm also wondering if a wrestler would opt not use the double grapevine even if he had the chance, seeing that it looks pretty embarrassing (for the wrestler pinning maybe, but especially humiliating for the guy getting pinned). Who has been pinned with the double grapevine? Is what I think about it being a pretty humiliating move to get pinned with true?

Anyway, just wondering. Thanks.

P.S. If any of you don't know what I'm talking about, I've attached a photo of the move here.

[Spider]

Yes, it's very effective if the top man has the legs in securely, extends his legs, arches his back, and lifts the head to prevent bridging. The top man can wrap both arms around the head and lift it off the mat - it is a legal headlock in this situation even without an arm encircled.

[DoubleGrapevine]

The top man can wrap both arms around the head and lift it off the mat - it is a legal headlock in this situation even without an arm encircled.

I've always wondered about that. So the ref wouldn't call that illegal in the double grapevine situation? Wouldn't a situation like that potentially cut off the breath or circulation in the bottom guy?

[Spider]

I've always wondered about that. So the ref wouldn't call that illegal in the double grapevine situation? Wouldn't a situation like that potentially cut off the breath or circulation in the bottom guy?

No because all the pressure is on the back of the head, so breathing and circulation are not impaired (unless the nose and mouth are pressed against the top man's chest), and there is no danger of neck or shoulder injury as in a full nelson. It's like a 3/4 nelson.

[Spider]

2006 - 2007 NFHS Case Book and Manual, page 41, 7.1.5 Situation C:

"This is not a headlock because the pressure applied here is against the head and not around it. The pressure here would be no different than the pressure applied against the head when using a three-quarter nelson."

[quick_single]

Double grapes in Freestyle = guaranteed fall.

[Champ Kind]

You won't get it against top level opponents.

[M Richardson]

A guy was pinning my daughter with this move when his coach yelled "If it's a boy, name him after me!" Absolute silence for about 5 seconds until I broke up laughing. I don't know if there is a counter for the move, but my daughter was laughing too hard to try and fight out of the hold. After the match, during the handshake, he tried to apologise. She stopped him by kissing him on the cheek and telling him "It's O.K., grandpa."

[quick_single]

You won't get it against top level opponents.

It happens all the time when guys either slip off a gut wrench or the top man knows how to defend it to force this position.