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Thread: Ramos Vs Schopp

  1. #28

    Default Re: Ramos Vs Schopp

    Well the problem you have is Conaway owns the H2H over Graff. Graff hasn't faced either of the top 2 either. I just don't see how Graff gets seeded ahead of Conaway due to the H2H matchup.

  2. #29

    Default Re: Ramos Vs Schopp

    If you only look at B1G results Conaway probably gets the 3 seed. If you look at their results from outside conference wrestling Graff's resume is much stronger than Conaway's.
    "Whatever you are, be a good one." Abraham Lincoln

  3. #30

    Default Re: Ramos Vs Schopp

    Graff has been destroying his competition since his loss to Conaway. If any of you actually watched the match he was on his way to destroying Conaway also. Not sure what happened as Graff isn't one to gas. I actually believe he hit his head prior to the collapse (seriously). I think most on here would agree that pinning Wolfensperger was a good win, and dominating McGuire who just beat Morrison was a pretty good win. Between the B1G's and Nationals it will all get sorted out. Despite Zapp's shots at Graff's, I doubt the betting would be heavy either way in a Ramos versus Graff match at this point.


    Quote Originally Posted by Zapp Brannigan View Post
    Graff's wins since losing to Conaway

    22. Tyler Graff Maj Kyle Visconti (Ohio State) 25-11 19-3

    23. Tyler Graff Tech Alonzo Shepard (Indiana) 23-7 20-3

    24. Tyler Graff Tech Danny Sabatello (Purdue) 21-5 21-3

    25. Tyler Graff Tech Corey Hodowanic (Minnesota) 18-2 22-3

    26. Tyler Graff Fall Levi Wolfensperger (Northern Iowa) 2:55 23-3

    27. Tyler Graff Dec Mackenzie McGuire (Kent State) 8-2 24-3


    A real murderer's row. Basically, his reason for picking Graff is...because he wants Graff to win. Which is fine, there are certainly weirder results in wrestling history that Tyler Graff beating Tony Ramos, and I'm being purposely facetious here. But all evidence that we have this season shows Ramos has been the best guy other than Stieber at the weight, and it's not particularly close.

  4. #31

    Default Re: Ramos Vs Schopp

    Let's look at common opponents

    Graff's wins since losing to Conaway

    22. Tyler Graff Maj Kyle Visconti (Ohio State) 25-11 19-3
    Tony Ramos Tech Kyle Visconti (Ohio State) 30-14


    23. Tyler Graff Tech Alonzo Shepard (Indiana) 23-7 20-3

    24. Tyler Graff Tech Danny Sabatello (Purdue) 21-5 21-3
    Tony Ramos Maj Danny Sabatello (Purdue) 13-4

    25. Tyler Graff Tech Corey Hodowanic (Minnesota) 18-2 22-3

    26. Tyler Graff Fall Levi Wolfensperger (Northern Iowa) 2:55 23-3

    27. Tyler Graff Dec Mackenzie McGuire (Kent State) 8-2 24-3, (not exactly common, but MacKenzie beat Morrison 3-2 same day)

    Tony Ramos Dec Jon Morrison (Oklahoma State) 3-2

    Graff also beat Schopp 6-0.

    I'm feeling pretty good about a Graff versus Ramos match up!



  5. #32

    Default Re: Ramos Vs Schopp

    I believe that head to head criteria will trump any outside of the conference B1G results. Conaway getting pinned does not matter in seeding either by both Ramos and Streebler. wouldnt matter if he lost by 10 or 1 either. A loss carries the same weight no matter how he lost. Graff not facing either Ramos or Streebler makes the head to head even more important. IF the B1G is seeded the way it should be it goes Ramos/Streebler, Conaway, Graff. Any past AA performances, or outside of the B1G matches, etc.....are irrelevant to seeding as a head to head is weighted much heavier. Same goes with Nationals when they seed. A head to head will always trump somebody beating somebody who beat that one guy, who lost to his brothers friend, etc.....

  6. #33

    Default Re: Ramos Vs Schopp

    I hope you're right, as I would love to see Conaway seeded #3! If he gets to the B1G Semi's he has a shot at being seeded come nationals.
    "Whatever you are, be a good one." Abraham Lincoln

  7. #34
    Super Moderator Zapp Brannigan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ramos Vs Schopp

    Sure. If we just make up reasons to discount Graff's loss, it makes it really easy to make the case. HE's been dominating his opponents, and they've all been middling. Wolfensperger has given up bonus to all of his top 10 opponents that I can see. He got pinned by Stieber and majored by Beckman, Mango, and McCormick. Hardly a win to set the world on fire.

    Look, you can pretend that this is an even match on paper if you like. There is literally nothing to back it up outside of a Sudden Victory win 2 years ago. Ramos is the returning NCAA 3rd place guy, Graff's highest finish is 5th. Ramos is undefeated, Graff is not. Ramos pinned Conaway, Graff lost. There is no way to favor Graff over Ramos outside of just having a personal rooting interest. Which is fine, but don't hide it.
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  8. #35

    Default Re: Ramos Vs Schopp

    If I could post a poll I would. I think 80% of the people on this site would pick Ramos.

  9. #36

    Default Re: Ramos Vs Schopp

    Quote Originally Posted by Zapp Brannigan View Post
    Sure. If we just make up reasons to discount Graff's loss, it makes it really easy to make the case. HE's been dominating his opponents, and they've all been middling. Wolfensperger has given up bonus to all of his top 10 opponents that I can see. He got pinned by Stieber and majored by Beckman, Mango, and McCormick. Hardly a win to set the world on fire.
    Graff did wrestle at 133 before losing to Conaway. He beat Schopp 6-0, he isn't middling. He beat Beckman 12-5 and 12-7, he isn't middling.

    I don't think Graff should be favored but I do think he's right there with Ramos based on what I've seen on his body of work at 133 this year & over his career. I'm not going to belabor the point but I'd love to see the match and I think it would be close. If you put a gun to my head I'd still pick Ramos because of Graff's tendency to give away matches at the end (Conaway, the Big 10 finals loss to Long was just a case of blowing it), but him winning wouldn't surprise me.

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