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Thread: Changes coming to the National Duals

  1. #1
    Olympic Champ kr1963's Avatar
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    Default Changes coming to the National Duals

    NWCA looking at improving dual format - Sports | Centre Daily Times

    he National Wrestling Coaches Association called the Penn State wrestling offices once. They called again. And again.

    Coach Cael Sanderson told NWCA executive director Mike Moyer the same thing each time: We’re flattered you want our young team in the 2011 NWCA National Duals. We respect your event. We aren’t making the trip to Cedar Falls, Iowa, for the 16-team tournament.

    Other prominent coaches declined Moyer’s invitation. Iowa coach Tom Brands isn’t bringing the Hawkeyes, who have won three straight national duals titles, to Cedar Falls this weekend.

    Instead of traveling to Iowa, Penn State is participating in this weekend’s Virginia Duals, a nice event, yet one lacking the same punch as the national duals. Iowa wrestles Southern Illinois- Edwardsville on Friday.

    “I like Moyer,” Sanderson said. “I like the NWCA. But ultimately we want to do what’s in the best interest of our program and we felt like we were getting what we needed from the Virginia Duals.”

    Moyer isn’t dwelling on the no-shows. The NWCA’s event attracted four of the nation’s top-five teams. Penn State, tied for second with Oklahoma State in the USA Today/NWCA rankings, is the only top-five team missing from the field. Iowa is ranked seventh.

    “We still have a lot of really, really good teams coming and we have a very, very strong wrestling spectator base in Iowa,” Moyer said. “My guess is the Iowa wrestling community will show up.”

    Spectators might be witnessing the final national duals in its current format.
    The NWCA wants to overhaul its Division I duals by creating an event comparable to the NCAA basketball tournament. The event would include a 16-team field comprised of 11 conference champions and five at-large selections.

    The tournament would start the second Sunday of February at four regional sites. It would conclude with college wrestling’s Final Four a week later.

    Coaches voiced unanimous support for the changes during the NWCA’s annual convention last August. Moyer said the new format could be implemented as early as next season.
    “At the end of the day we have to grow the spectator base at the institution level,” Moyer said. “The primary way to do that is to build around the dual meet and make it meaningful.”

    Moyer pitched the idea to a reporter during a phone conversation Tuesday evening. The reporter initially called Moyer to discuss Penn State’s absence at this year’s national duals. By the end of the conversation, the reporter forgot the Nittany Lions will not see a Big 12 team until the NCAA Championships.

    No Big 12 programs attended last week’s 30-team Southern Scuffle won by Penn State and Cornell. None teams are attending the Virginia Duals. The Nittany Lions wrestled Oklahoma State and Oklahoma in last year’s tournament.

    “I have said before that when we signed up we thought Oklahoma and Oklahoma State would be there,” Sanderson said. “But it’s fine. We’re not going to analyze where we should be.”

    Sanderson said his No. 1 goal is to prepare his team for the NCAA Championships. Attending the Virginia Duals are part of the program’s year-round training plan.
    Sanderson added that flying to Cedar Falls less than two weeks after the Southern Scuffle presents logistical challenges. The trip would have cost Penn State $20,000, according to one source.

    “It’s a lot different for us to go out there than a team in the Midwest that can just get in the bus,” Sanderson said.

    Moyer said a revamped national duals eliminates guesswork from scheduling decisions. He envisions most coaches placing a significant emphasis on qualifying for duals, increasing the emphasis on November, December and January results and possibly making February as exciting as March.

    Wrestling’s regular season can use a boost. Lock Haven and Ohio State forfeited weights during meets against Penn State at Rec Hall. Arizona State forfeited two weights during a home meet against Oklahoma State earlier this week.

    Resting for March is fine. But is it worthwhile for Oklahoma State to fly to Arizona to wrestle eight bouts? Moyer said the proposed format dangles a desirable carrot — a spot in a major 16-team tournament — in front of coaches.

    The NWCA and NCAA are collaborating on the plan. But Moyer said they are “a long way” from making the duals a NCAA-sanctioned championship.

    Moyer is confident February represents the best time to conduct a the tournament. The NWCA surveyed 22 state athletic associations and found that a dual meet championship after the traditional state tournament would be anticlimactic.

    The PIAA debuted its duals in 1999 and 16 Class AA and AAA teams will wrestle in Hershey next month. Some coaches balked at the timing of the 1999 event.

    Northampton’s Don Rohn brought his JV team to the first duals. The tournament is now staged during the second week of February, and many programs consider a state dual meet title as meaningful as the team scoring crown.

    Dual meets embody America’s sporting culture better than individual tournaments. Television’s highest rated programs are NFL games. Football, basketball and baseball generate more viewers, advertisers and headlines than wrestling, track and field, tennis and non- Tiger Woods golf events.

    Moyer is right when he says compelling on-campus meets are the best way to help wrestling. Sitting through a two-hour dual meet is easier on a wrestling newcomer than enduring a 12-hour day in an eight-mat gym.

    Imagine Penn State, Iowa, Oklahoma State and Cornell surviving regionals and competing at the Bryce Jordan Center on Feb. 19, 2012.

    That’s must-see stuff. That’s the kind of stuff that makes you forget the difficulties of assembling the nation’s best teams before March.



  2. #2

    Default Re: Changes coming to the National Duals

    I like the idea...I say if you say no one year, you are taken off the list for the next year.

    Just kidding. That being said, I think Iowa and Penn State would have been outstanding additions to Natty Duals. I am sure Iowa will have its hands full though with SIU-E.
    "Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until they speak."

  3. #3

    Default Re: Changes coming to the National Duals

    The days of the National Duals in its traditional time slot and format could be nearing an end.
    Mike Moyer has a vision for the tournament. It includes an NCAA tag attached to the title, an in-season qualification process, regional tournaments on college campuses and a Final Four every February to determine a dual meet national champion.
    “Where we’re really challenged is our whole infrastructure is currently designed to support an individual tournament at the end of the season, which is counterproductive to really placing very much importance on dual meets at all,” said Moyer, the executive director of the National Wrestling Coaches Association. “Now we do have some traditional rivalries out there when Iowa wrestles Iowa State or Oklahoma State comes to town, but those are much more the exception than the rule.
    “I always ask myself one fundamental question: Would as many people follow the NBA or the NFL or Major League Baseball if the outcome of the games didn’t matter?”
    Moyer wants to make every dual matter. He wants to see the champions of the sport’s nine conferences and one super regional plus six at-large selections vying for the NCAA dual title. He wants to see those 16 teams tangling on the second Sunday of February in predetermined regional sites with the four winners advancing to wrestling’s Final Four the following Sunday.


    That was taken from Hawkcentral



    I dont' know if I like the idea of taking the winners of the conferences plus one wild card. Seems like most years it would leave out deserving teams in the B10 and B12. Some of the worst teams in those conferences would beat the best teams in say the WWC or ACC.

    I like the new format but just think it would be a shame if some of the best teams in the country get left out because their conference is so much tougher than other conferences.
    THE MOST POWERFUL WEAPON ON EARTH IS THE HUMAN SOUL ON FIRE

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  4. #4

    Default Re: Changes coming to the National Duals

    I think its relatively fair. You want to be in the argument for the National Dual Championship, win or come second in your Major Conference.
    "Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until they speak."

  5. #5

    Default Re: Changes coming to the National Duals

    I think it would be better if they used some sort of a poll system and took the top 16 teams and split them into the regionals and have a final four. I would hate to see a team like Minnesota get left out because they finished third to Iowa and Wisconsin when a team like UNI gets in but they are clearly not as good at Minnesota...This year. (in years to come UNI will be deserving.)
    THE MOST POWERFUL WEAPON ON EARTH IS THE HUMAN SOUL ON FIRE

    "I like to relax with a chainsaw." Tom Brands 12/4/09

  6. #6
    World Champ ODH's Avatar
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    Default Re: Changes coming to the National Duals

    If you just took the top teams without regard for conference you would end up with most of the Big 10/Big 5 and maybe two or three other teams.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Changes coming to the National Duals

    Quote Originally Posted by ODH View Post
    If you just took the top teams without regard for conference you would end up with most of the Big 10/Big 5 and maybe two or three other teams.
    As long as they were the best teams I don't see a problem with it.

    Having said that, I think the new system they have laid out is better than what we have now and I welcome the change. Although I will miss having nat duals in Cedar Falls, and it will ruin the tournament for all other divisions.
    THE MOST POWERFUL WEAPON ON EARTH IS THE HUMAN SOUL ON FIRE

    "I like to relax with a chainsaw." Tom Brands 12/4/09

  8. #8

    Default Re: Changes coming to the National Duals

    For selfish reasons I like the Duals in the Midwest and Cedar Falls specificially obviously because I can make it there with no more than a 4 hour drive. But, I like the idea of moving it around though too just need to make sure it is a draw in other places nationally, and if it is not, then bring it back to the heartland of wrestling.

    The divisional leaders idea is crazy I would say though, there has to be another way because the Big 10 and Little 5, soon to be Smaller 4 will get hosed. The Big 10 alone has some of the best teams in the country that need to be involved with Iowa, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Nebraska coming, Michigan, Ohio State, Penn State, etc......

    The Small 4 I guess it would be fine to let them all fight it out.

    What about some sort of strength of schedule, Records, Polls statistical analysis similar to the BCS with Football? Now, the BCS isnt a perfect situation, but nothing really is.

  9. #9

    Default Re: Changes coming to the National Duals

    Ideally they need to figure out whether the championship is a National Duals or an Individual Duals. Isn't swimming and track and field kind of the same?
    "Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until they speak."

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