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Thread: Jordan Oliver most popular pick for a lock?

  1. #28
    Olympic Champ kr1963's Avatar
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    Default Re: Jordan Oliver most popular pick for a lock?

    Oliver has been averaging an impressive 4.9 team points per match but has only beaten 2 guys in the top 10, (Hochstrasser & Carter).And though he still may walk through 133 I still feel a battle tested Kellen Russell is just as much as a lock as Oliver & maybe even a little more. I think Kellen just might end up with the NCAA OW for the people he will have to beat for a 3rd or 4th time this year. Watching him @ the B10s against Kennedy & Thorn I felt like the outcome was never in doubt.

    And while Russell may only be averaging 3.7 team points per win he is 33-0 vs 23-0 (Oliver) & he is 11-0 vs the top 11 while JO is 2-0. Russell is more like the Patriots or Ravens while Oliver is like the Falcons. Oliver is flashy but hasn't beaten anyone yet while Russell has been slugging out for most of the last half of the season.

    Oliver has yet to face any of the top 6 besides Hochstrasser, all of whom could give Oliver a run for his money. That includes Long, Graff & Ramos.

    And don't bother comparing Russell of 2 & 3 years ago to now. He has had a year off to get a new appreciation of the sport & has worked on things mentally so he is ready to go next week to win. I would put them pretty close as far as locks go.

    If Howe fully recovers & adjusts he could beat JB. I don't see anyone beating Russell.
    Last edited by kr1963; 03-11-2011 at 01:32 PM.

  2. #29

    Default Re: Jordan Oliver most popular pick for a lock?

    Quote Originally Posted by kr1963 View Post
    Oliver has been averaging an impressive 4.9 team points per match but has only beaten 2 guys in the top 10, (Hochstrasser & Carter).And though he still may walk through 133 I still feel a battle tested Kellen Russell is just as much as a lock as Oliver & maybe even a little more. I think Kellen just might end up with the NCAA OW for the people he will have to beat for a 3rd or 4th time this year. Watching him @ the B10s against Kennedy & Thorn I felt like the outcome was never in doubt.
    Well KR, some good points there I guess but I still think that running that perilous gauntlet of 141 is going to be a major pain in the ass. If he does win it, it will definitively prove that the guy is a friggin' animal, and deserving of O.W. Man, 141 is going to be a fun bracket to watch, just full of names, reminds me of 149 a few years ago.

  3. #30

    Default Re: Jordan Oliver most popular pick for a lock?

    I agree once again oldfart, I think with 141 having all of those guys that are so close, heck Alton who's the #6 seed and nobody is really picking him above that seed but he's wrestled all of those top 5 guys to decisions I could see him wrestling above that and beating one of them to bust the brackets. Throw in Thorn who's got some losses as does Marion and Kennedy and I will pick Oliver as my money guy to get it all day long. Especially after watching the Oliver vs. Hoch. match again and seeing Graffs pathetic Finals at Big Tens. And Graff beat Carter pretty good, as did Oliver. I just think his wins against Hoch. and Carter are enough for me to say I see him going undefeated and winning much more likely than Russell.

  4. #31

    Default Re: Jordan Oliver most popular pick for a lock?

    I don't see any of these guys as a lock. Caldwell really gave Burroughs a run for his money in the Big 12's and Caldwell was pursuing Burroughs, not the other way around. Burroughs beat Howe 10-7 I believe it was. Not a dominant performance, and I can't see Howe giving up points like that again. He's fine going into overtime 1-1, that's his game in the big matches. At that point anyone can win. Sure Caldwell didn't take any shots, but he was the aggressor and should have won that match. Also with Oliver, I saw him in the Big 12 finals and he won, but his opponents record was barely above .500 so I don't have much to go on. Long has been very impressive since his loss to Iowa, I think he's a different guy now.

  5. #32

    Default Re: Jordan Oliver most popular pick for a lock?

    Quote Originally Posted by Daisy Cutter View Post
    Sure Caldwell didn't take any shots, but he was the aggressor and should have won that match.

    Caldwell should've been hit for stalling at least three times during that match. He was not the aggressor. The aggressor doesnt back up the entire match not letting his opponent get close enough to do anything. Burroughs was trying but Caldwell was running. It's a good strategy for Caldwell against a superior wrestler in Burroughs but you've got to get in a cheap takedown to make it work.
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  6. #33

    Default Re: Jordan Oliver most popular pick for a lock?

    Quote Originally Posted by Herkey#1 View Post
    Caldwell should've been hit for stalling at least three times during that match. He was not the aggressor. The aggressor doesnt back up the entire match not letting his opponent get close enough to do anything. Burroughs was trying but Caldwell was running. It's a good strategy for Caldwell against a superior wrestler in Burroughs but you've got to get in a cheap takedown to make it work.
    Didn't see the match but I heard that Caldwell was doing the opposite, closing the gap on Burroughs and not letting him operate in space to shoot those doubles. At any rate I heard Caldwell wasn't shooting, just smothering, and was thus stalling in that way, and I would tend to believe that.

    Any match against Burroughs in which he only scores 2 points says to me that some serious stalling was going on. Burroughs is at the level where nobody is going to limiting his offense to that degree unless they are either stalling their ass off or they have god-like defense, which I haven't heard Caldwell has. Howe is really the only guy remotely capable of wrestling Burroughs in a hard match and limiting him to 2 pts. If Caldwell was actively engaging Burroughs (like Howe did), I'm pretty sure we're going to see a lot more scoring. But who knows, maybe Caldwell really did do that good of a job and deserved to win.

  7. #34

    Default Re: Jordan Oliver most popular pick for a lock?

    For what it's worth, here's a list (from most certain to least certain) of who I think will be Div.I champs at each weight:

    1. Jordan Burroughs 165 - Either Caldwell or Howe may push him, but Howe's not 100% yet. He's a gamer and will be very difficult to beat at this tournament.
    2. Jordan Oliver 133 - (note to self: name my next born son "Jordan") - Oliver is pretty dominant, looks very good. The only reason I don't have him at #1 is Hoch. Hoch will have a game plan in place to give himself a chance to win.
    3. Darion Caldwell 149 - A lot of speculation still regarding his shoulder injury, etc., but he's still the most talented wrestler in the field.
    4. Jonathon Reader 174 - He's been lights out all year, but either Lewnes or Ruth will present him with some challenges in the final.
    5. David Taylor 157 - Now is when things start to get a little murky. Perhaps the most technical and aggressive scorer in college wrestling, but beating Fittery and Hall won't be easy.
    6. Kellen Russell 141 - He's wrestled the best all year and handled them all, but he's got a big target on his back with competition who can and will make adjustments to try and beat him (i.e. Marion).
    7. Zach Rey 285 - This will probably come down to Rey and Flores again. Flip a coin on who will win.
    8. Matt McDonough 125 - The big question... can he stop "Robotilt"? No disrespect to Mr. Robles, but he really is a tilting machine. No one has stopped him yet this year. McDonough better be working on stopping tilts from Uncle Lofthouse this week, because if he can't stop a Lofthouse tilt (or someone else on that Iowa team with incredible upper body strength), he may not be able stop a Robotilt.
    9. Dustin Kilgore 197 - This is a toss-up between Kilgore, Simaz and Foster and maybe even Brandvold.
    10. Joe Leblanc 184 - Even more of toss-up with 7-8 guys who could win it all with an injured Kirk Smith.

  8. #35

    Default Re: Jordan Oliver most popular pick for a lock?

    I know that Covington doesn't have a lot of marquee wins this year but he's beaten AMU twice and I believe his only loss this year is to a guy who is no longer at that weight. Don't count him out, he almost stole one from Lewnesss last year at the NCAAs and he could make an appearance in the finals.
    Quote Originally Posted by Flop The Nuts View Post
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  9. #36

    Default Re: Jordan Oliver most popular pick for a lock?

    Quote Originally Posted by Snackem View Post
    I know that Covington doesn't have a lot of marquee wins this year but he's beaten AMU twice and I believe his only loss this year is to a guy who is no longer at that weight. Don't count him out, he almost stole one from Lewnesss last year at the NCAAs and he could make an appearance in the finals.
    Agreed. Co Co big time bracket buster and is a TOUGH match up for anybody at 74.
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